Author Topic: Old photos of and around Liverpool  (Read 834340 times)

Offline Big Red Richie

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #840 on: December 7, 2011, 09:22:29 pm »
And a couple more.


Offline Red Beret

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #841 on: December 8, 2011, 01:20:28 pm »
You look at those pics and you wonder it's a miracle the three graces weren't levelled.  Just makes me angry to think how the most intact structures there - the Goree, the Overhead and the Customs House - were pulled down when there was plenty already flattened.
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Offline Tsar Kastik

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #842 on: December 8, 2011, 04:37:46 pm »
Probably the easiest targets in the whole city to hit and came out unscathed..coincidence? possibly not.
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Offline Red Beret

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #843 on: December 8, 2011, 05:39:30 pm »
On a side note, I read the today that James Street was closed due to tiles being blown off the derelict White Star Building.  Hope they can get that building fixed soon.
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Offline The Gulleysucker

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #844 on: December 8, 2011, 06:17:02 pm »
Probably the easiest targets in the whole city to hit and came out unscathed..coincidence? possibly not.

I don't think they had the accuracy required for such pinpoint destruction, it was probably just one of those fortunate things.

They certainly came close with this bomb on the Overhead ...


from here ... http://www.liverpoolblitz70.co.uk/tag/dockers-umbrella/



...but while they concentrated on the dock system and attempts at the railways, many of their bombs were scattered all over the place (just like all airforces of the time).



The white(r) areas are the bomb damage to the centre.


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Offline Danny Boys Dad

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #845 on: December 8, 2011, 06:20:48 pm »
You look at those pics and you wonder it's a miracle the three graces weren't levelled.  Just makes me angry to think how the most intact structures there - the Goree, the Overhead and the Customs House - were pulled down when there was plenty already flattened.

Intact but very badly damaged as far as I was aware, the customs house was just a shell wasn't it? These days they might convert it into something by Urban Splash or someone like that but maybe then there just wasn't the money.
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Offline Red Beret

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #846 on: December 8, 2011, 06:25:27 pm »
Intact but very badly damaged as far as I was aware, the customs house was just a shell wasn't it? These days they might convert it into something by Urban Splash or someone like that but maybe then there just wasn't the money.

Most of the books I've read on the subject say the building was still structurally sound, despite being largely reduced to walls.  I tend to blame a lack of political will on the matter.  You look at The Strand now and it's hard to believe it accommodated the Goree Warehouses, plus the Overhead, with room to spare.  They certainly had no qualms about demolishing the original Exchange Flags building in the 30s either.
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Offline Big Red Richie

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #847 on: December 8, 2011, 09:29:54 pm »
Just a point of note about strategic bombing.

The accuracy of both British* and German bomb sites during the early years of WW2 was abysmal.

In most cases, if a bomb was dropped within two miles of it's target, it was considered successful.

*prior to the Norden bombsight.


So bombs falling within a mile or so of their target was considered successful.  Both the British and German airforces compensated for this, by going for quantity not accuracy, and mixing and matching their ordnance with high explosive, incendary, and a mix of other ordnance, in order to cause maximum destruction and disruption.





A little bit of useless information for you..... taken from the plaque outside said pub.


Offline Mumm-Ra

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #848 on: December 8, 2011, 09:43:36 pm »
My Grandma said a lot of people used to hold a grudge against the Irish because, according to her, they had left their lights on during blackouts, to enable German bombers to hit Liverpool. Anyone know if there's any truth to this or just an old wives' tale?

Offline Big Red Richie

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #849 on: December 8, 2011, 10:47:28 pm »
No idea to be honest, but I'd doubt it to be fair, as at that time, the populace at large in Liverpool was very very Irish heavy.

It still is to a large extent, with something like 60+ % having Irish ancestry.
(three of my four grandparents are of Irish descent)

If it did actuall happen as you say, then it was an isolated incident or an old wives tale, as anyone who was actualy in the city or experienced the May Blitz, would not under any circumstances have done such a thing, without being dragged into the street and lynched.

My Aunt who is now 78 and lived through the blitz as a child, even now, will cower like a small child when she hears thunder.

Even as an adult, she still hides under the stairs when their is a thunder storm.


To be on the recieving end of a bombing campaign.Thats the psychological impact that it had on any individual (English/German or other)



With the exception of soldiers serving in battle, not many  of us now-a-days can even comprehend the horror or psychological trauma that being bombed on a daily/nightly occurance can have on you.

As I said. My aunt, even now, still suffers the trauma.
« Last Edit: December 8, 2011, 10:54:56 pm by Big Red Richie »

Offline The Gulleysucker

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #850 on: December 9, 2011, 09:16:26 am »
My Grandma said a lot of people used to hold a grudge against the Irish because, according to her, they had left their lights on during blackouts, to enable German bombers to hit Liverpool. Anyone know if there's any truth to this or just an old wives' tale?

While undoubtedly there were some vehemently anti-British and thus deemed Nazi sympathisers in neutral Eire, just as there were Nazi sympathisers here in the UK too, considering Dublin was bombed by the Germans, on more than one occasion I would treat that very much as an old wives tale.

The Luftwaffe largely navigated to the their target at that stage of the war using a radio beam system, Knickebein, two widely spaced transmitters on the continent broadcasting directional beams with different pulses that were set up to intersect approximately over the intended target. It was very effective and better than the average navigator trying dead reckoning using the stars to get his position over a blacked out country like the UK ,something that the Luftwaffe navigators were not even trained in as they believed very much in Vorsprung durch technik.

To target Liverpool the beams would get them to the general area and if out over the Irish sea and at altitude, the lights of Dublin could possibly be seen and used to confirm a general position, but no more than the lights in Switzerland or Sweden when the RAF bombed close to those areas.

Anyway, we discovered largely by a bit of fortuitous Enigma that the Germans used this system quite early on and what followed became known as the Battle of the beams, and we found a way to bend them ie move the target without the Germans realising it.  This caused a lot of confusion resulting in many bombs being dropped by the Germans in strange places.

There is still a persistant myth that resurfaces every so often that the devastation of Coventry was possibly the result of this bending, as well as the (accidental) bombing of Dublin, but there is no proof beyond conjecture.
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Offline Tsar Kastik

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #851 on: December 9, 2011, 02:53:04 pm »
This one got in right behind the 3 Graces



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Offline Mumm-Ra

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #852 on: December 22, 2011, 09:38:47 pm »
My Grandma said a lot of people used to hold a grudge against the Irish because, according to her, they had left their lights on during blackouts, to enable German bombers to hit Liverpool. Anyone know if there's any truth to this or just an old wives' tale?

Sorry, I forgot I'd posted this question, didn't mean to ignore the replies. Thanks Richie and Gulley, very informative stuff. I definitely leaned towards the old wives tale theory myself, because of the large Irish contingent in Liverpool (my Dad's family for one) and the simple fact that it would be a bit of a leap of faith, wouldn't it! Leaving your lights on so that the bombers would see them and use them as a guide to bomb somewhere else, and not you...

Gulley that wiki link to the Dublin bombings, which I never knew about, had this interesting tidbit though:

Quote
Unlike British cities Dublin was not subject to full blackout regulations, so the city would have been visible from the air, unlike Belfast. A limited blackout had been ordered as from 15 April. An Irish Department of Defence report dated 16 July 1941 noted that un-blacked-out Irish lights were often used by the Luftwaffe as an "aid to navigation" towards Northern Ireland, and that: "...the lights on the south coast and Dublin were used as points of arrival and departure in synchronized timing."

I bet that's where the story came from.

Cheers fellas, great thread this.


Offline Red Beret

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #853 on: December 22, 2011, 11:29:28 pm »
If there is one good thing about the new Liverpool Museum it's being able to sit in the last remaining Overhead Railway Carriage at it's correct height. 
I don't always visit Lobster Pot.  But when I do. I sit.

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Offline The Gulleysucker

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #854 on: December 23, 2011, 04:59:05 am »
Not a photo but I found this nice and slightly unusual seasonal picture of a painting on a site in New Zealand here.



Don't think it's been posted before on here.

All that's missing is a Merry Christmas/Seasons/Festive Greetings type message on it.
I don't do polite so fuck yoursalf with your stupid accusations...

Right you fuckwit I will show you why you are talking out of your fat arse...

Mutton Geoff (Obviously a real nice guy)

Offline only6times

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #855 on: December 23, 2011, 10:21:57 am »
Was it you mentioned on Radio 2 the other day?
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Offline The Gulleysucker

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #856 on: December 23, 2011, 02:42:23 pm »
Me? No idea and can't imagine why I should be.
What was it about?
I don't do polite so fuck yoursalf with your stupid accusations...

Right you fuckwit I will show you why you are talking out of your fat arse...

Mutton Geoff (Obviously a real nice guy)

Offline only6times

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #857 on: December 23, 2011, 05:53:20 pm »
Me? No idea and can't imagine why I should be.
What was it about?

Just on the traffic report mate, your bestiality thing is still a secret.
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Offline The Gulleysucker

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #858 on: December 23, 2011, 07:10:30 pm »
Just on the traffic report mate...

Not me Guv, honest, probably an imposter.

..... your bestiality thing is still a secret.

Phew... ;)
I don't do polite so fuck yoursalf with your stupid accusations...

Right you fuckwit I will show you why you are talking out of your fat arse...

Mutton Geoff (Obviously a real nice guy)

Offline only6times

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #859 on: December 23, 2011, 07:18:30 pm »
Not me Guv, honest, probably an imposter.

Phew... ;)
Nothing to be ashamed of. I once got fined £50 for having sex with an animal.

Me mate got fined £75 for acting the coat.
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Offline monkeyharris

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #860 on: December 29, 2011, 12:15:27 pm »
Not a photee per say but snap of a pride and joy poster I picked up in an auction a few years back - had to get it restored as it was pretty knackered. Got a few other old Liverpool prints and maps on the walls i've picked up on various travels is anyone would like to see them too

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Offline AnfieldIron

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #861 on: December 29, 2011, 03:05:25 pm »
Wrote this in the other thread but it might be best suited here.

Any old pictures of Walton Breck Rd/Kop end?

I was 4 when the old Kop went so can't remember what the outside of it looked like.

Just would be nice to see :wave

Offline Big Red Richie

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #862 on: December 29, 2011, 03:43:44 pm »
One event that anyone interested in football always remembers is their first football match. I was a late-starter, being 13 before I went along to watch the famous Spurs double team of 1961 play Sheffield United.
 The match passed by in a blur but my abiding memory was being jostled in a huge crowd – mainly flat-capped men all smoking their Woodbines or Park Drives. There were the old wooden rattles and the odd handbell – all creating an atmosphere that got me hooked for life. Once I arrived in Liverpool, I did the unforgiveable and switched allegiance (not a bad thing since the last major honour won by a Sheffield club was back in 1935 I believe).
 What I like about the photograph is that it captures the spirit of a typical Saturday afternoon match day. I can never understand why so few photographers film that aspect of the sport rather than what is happening on the pitch. Football is such an important part of our culture and needs a better photographic record. I have started taking match day scenes (in the expectation of a last season at Anfield – so a few more seasons to go) and have noticed one or two others are thinking along the same lines.

http://streetsofliverpool.co.uk/category/sport/


Offline Big Red Richie

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #863 on: December 29, 2011, 03:57:05 pm »
Those were the days my friend. . . . . . .


I've got a couple of dozen of the outside of the old Spion Kop, that I took back in 1987.  I havent got time to post them all now, but here's a quick trio.

Aaaah! The memories........... £1.80  to get into the match.  :o


Offline 1021

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #864 on: December 29, 2011, 04:02:07 pm »
If anyone knows of somewhere with old pictures of Crumb Street, Upper Fredrick Street, St James' Street, I would really appreciate it.
My 90 year old nan has been reminiscing over Christmas and I would love to able to show her some pictures.
I got the Lucas thing wrong. Will be right on Henderson though. Play him RM, play him CM - Not good enough and never will be.

Offline vicgill

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #865 on: December 29, 2011, 05:10:53 pm »
Not a photee per say but snap of a pride and joy poster I picked up in an auction a few years back - had to get it restored as it was pretty knackered. Got a few other old Liverpool prints and maps on the walls i've picked up on various travels is anyone would like to see them too




I am sure everybody would love to see them mate, but me mostly  ;D
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Offline vicgill

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #866 on: December 29, 2011, 05:18:20 pm »
If anyone knows of somewhere with old pictures of Crumb Street, Upper Fredrick Street, St James' Street, I would really appreciate it.
My 90 year old nan has been reminiscing over Christmas and I would love to able to show her some pictures.

here mate get onto this, it'll keep her going for another 90 yrs, my mams nearly 90 very proud of her

http://inacityliving.piczo.com/?cr=7&pc=tr
"Football is a simple game based on the giving and taking of passes, of controlling the ball and making yourself available to receive a pass, it is really that simple"

"Friend, mourn not, though he premature departs, his wisdom marches on within our hearts"
  
RIP Ray Osbourne, comrade, epic swindler, and Internet Terrorist Extraordinaire.

Offline Terry de Niro

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #867 on: December 29, 2011, 07:27:23 pm »
Wrote this in the other thread but it might be best suited here.

Any old pictures of Walton Breck Rd/Kop end?

I was 4 when the old Kop went so can't remember what the outside of it looked like.

Just would be nice to see :wave
Is this one old enough for you?   ;)

Offline Terry de Niro

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #868 on: December 29, 2011, 07:27:54 pm »
and...

Offline 1021

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #869 on: December 29, 2011, 10:59:48 pm »
here mate get onto this, it'll keep her going for another 90 yrs, my mams nearly 90 very proud of her

http://inacityliving.piczo.com/?cr=7&pc=tr

Thanks Vic.
Going to have a look through now, can't wait to showing her some tomorrow.
I got the Lucas thing wrong. Will be right on Henderson though. Play him RM, play him CM - Not good enough and never will be.

Offline monkeyharris

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #870 on: December 30, 2011, 11:02:50 am »
Heres the rest of my collection of Liverpool based posters/maps
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Offline Tsar Kastik

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #871 on: December 30, 2011, 11:35:47 am »
Love them Monkey, they're great.
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Offline Big Red Richie

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #872 on: December 31, 2011, 01:01:31 am »
Are they original newspapers?   as they look like.

What's the date on said newspapers?

Offline monkeyharris

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #873 on: December 31, 2011, 12:53:08 pm »
Are they original newspapers?   as they look like.

What's the date on said newspapers?
No they're original timetable posters and shipping charts
1832 for the Port chart - 1835 for the handcoloured Mersey one and 1892 for the two railway ones (I bought them in an auction as a job lot of 8 timetables - with those two only relevant to Liverpool)
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Offline Tsar Kastik

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #874 on: January 5, 2012, 09:48:33 am »
from the latest blog on here....http://streetsofliverpool.co.uk/



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Offline The Gulleysucker

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #875 on: January 5, 2012, 10:03:03 am »

Bit of a changed landscape on that one. View now.

That Picture Post on Liverpool at the bottom of the blog looks good.



I don't do polite so fuck yoursalf with your stupid accusations...

Right you fuckwit I will show you why you are talking out of your fat arse...

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Offline Tsar Kastik

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #876 on: January 5, 2012, 03:02:30 pm »
« Last Edit: January 5, 2012, 03:04:13 pm by Tsar Kastik »
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Offline John C

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #877 on: January 6, 2012, 12:13:57 am »
The winter of '63, never to be forgotten by those 'lucky' enough to have been there...this is from Wavertree.org.uk. and shows Sefton Park lake. click to enlarge
Great pic that mate

Offline vicgill

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #878 on: January 6, 2012, 04:39:02 pm »
Not a photee per say but snap of a pride and joy poster I picked up in an auction a few years back - had to get it restored as it was pretty knackered. Got a few other old Liverpool prints and maps on the walls i've picked up on various travels is anyone would like to see them too


Monkey mate they are class, thanks for showing them. I love maps, my mrs thinks I'm crackers
"Football is a simple game based on the giving and taking of passes, of controlling the ball and making yourself available to receive a pass, it is really that simple"

"Friend, mourn not, though he premature departs, his wisdom marches on within our hearts"
  
RIP Ray Osbourne, comrade, epic swindler, and Internet Terrorist Extraordinaire.

Offline Terry de Niro

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Re: Old photos of and around Liverpool
« Reply #879 on: January 6, 2012, 05:21:34 pm »
Monkey mate they are class, thanks for showing them. I love maps, my mrs thinks I'm crackers
I know you are mate..  ;)