Topic: Liverpool 0-3 West Ham FT

[TheTeflonJohn]

It's not just four games in though. It's a continuation of glaring failings and shortcomings since 2012.

I`m sure this season started four games ago.

[Dubred]

I just don't get stuff like this. Sami Hyypiä was a great defender, but that doesn't mean he's also a great coach. It's one thing doing it on the pitch yourself, but it's a completely different thing telling players how to do it. So far, Sami's managerial career seems to be mediocre at best. He had a good start with Leverkusen, but things went tits up rather quickly. I'm not saying he's a bad manager or a bad coach, but suggesting he'd come in and sort out our (or any teams defence for that matter) is just ludicrous. Having been a great defender might help becoming a good manager or coach, but there are many other (more important) factors in my view...

As far as the game is concerned, I am quite surprised about the reaction on here. At least in terms of points, we've had a decent start to the season in my view. We've messed up completely against West Ham and should have done better against Arsenal (i.e. scored at least one goal), but it's still early-days. That said, I'd also not just dismiss Saturday's game as "one of those days". There are certainly issues that need to be adressed...

Its never acceptable to lose by 3 goals at Anfield to anyone.....City/ Chelsea etc, nevermind West Ham.

That for one is enough for people to have the right to spout off.

However, I think people are more concerned by what we saw last season continuing into this season.

Prior to Bournemouth this season, our last game at Anfield we lost 1-3 to Crystal Palace.

There were some very strange decisions by the boss throughout last season which puzzled many in terms of selection and tactics.

I guess the concern is the first 3 games masked that and that we are slipping back into what we saw on one too many occasions last season.

He's just put himself under an enormous amount of pressure for the game against Utd.  I hate feeling this way but as a fan I'm going into that game very downbeat and not expecting much.

[Anywhichwayicant]

I`m sure this season started four games ago.

And I'm sure Rodgers has been here since 2012. I'm also sure he has spent a lot of money.

[Durlmints]

And I'm sure Rodgers has been here since 2012. I'm also sure he has spent a lot of money.

Mate it's a year of transition where is your patience? Have to give Brendan time, we don't want to be one of those clubs who sack their managers because they're not doing very well - otherwise we'll end up like Spurs! Who have spent like £200m less than us and finished above us 5 out of the last 6 seasons while also reaching a cup final last year. Would you really want that?

Plus when they ban all the flags and songs on the Kop we'll be fine. The players will be able to focus, presumably.

The club is in great hands.

[Red-Soldier]

And I'm sure Rodgers has been here since 2012. I'm also sure he has spent a lot of money.

300 million has been quoted on here.

Surely that should be more than enough to at least win a trophy 

[God's Left Peg]

That's a massive black mark against Rodgers for me if that is the case.  That would be blatant favouristism of an inferior player for no justifiable reason and would smack of a manager who is unprepared to recognise and correct his mistakes. 

Yes. It's not just the decision itself but all that it implies about the way he is managing the people who make up his squad. What the fuck must be going through the mind of Sakho? Or anybody else who can be alienated at the drop of a hat for no apparent logical reason? Maddening.

[SMASHerano]

Mate it's a year of transition where is your patience? Have to give Brendan time, we don't want to be one of those clubs who sack their managers because they're not doing very well - otherwise we'll end up like Spurs! Who have spent like £200m less than us and finished above us 5 out of the last 6 seasons while also reaching a cup final last year. Would you really want that?

Plus when they ban all the flags and songs on the Kop we'll be fine. The players will be able to focus, presumably.

The club is in great hands.

[kkjellquist]

Mate it's a year of transition where is your patience?

Is it me or have we had 4 years of transition under BR?

[TheTeflonJohn]

And I'm sure Rodgers has been here since 2012. I'm also sure he has spent a lot of money.

So after giving him a load of money in the summer for players, getting the backroom staff he wanted, it would definitely be a wise move to start thinking about fucking him off after the first defeat.

Maybe this fella put that plan in place.



"I know what we`ll do, back Rodgers to the hilt in the summer then start the process of fucking him off after four games in. All in favour say aye"

[Dubred]

300 million has been quoted on here.

Surely that should be more than enough to at least win a trophy 

So after giving him a load of money in the summer for players, getting the backroom staff he wanted, it would definitely be a wise move to start thinking about fucking him off after the first defeat.

Maybe this fella put that plan in place.



"I know what we`ll do, back Rodgers to the hilt in the summer then start the process of fucking him off after four games in. All in favour say aye"

Are we sure its the backroom staff Rodgers wanted?

Would he not have wanted to keep the guys he had last season?

If he had full involvement in recruiting the new staff thats fair enough but is there evidence he did?

[firing squad]

...getting the backroom staff he wanted..

LoL

[TheTeflonJohn]

Are we sure its the backroom staff Rodgers wanted?

Would he not have wanted to keep the guys he had last season?

If he had full involvement in recruiting the new staff thats fair enough but is there evidence he did?

Who knows?

The fact remains, it would be pretty fucking stupid to put all these plans in place this summer then start to rip it all up after the first defeat.

[CraigDS]

If he had full involvement in recruiting the new staff thats fair enough but is there evidence he did?

He said so himself the decision to makes the changes was his own.

The new back room staff certainly appear to be his choices, they are on the exact same page as him.

[TheTeflonJohn]

LoL

Go on then, entertain me.

[UNO]

Has anyone got or heard an explanation to why we came out 3-at-the-back after half time?

I'm still bewildered and unable to fathom that one.

What was the objective? Anyone ?

It's obvious that Rodgers was not trying to chase the game. He was trying to prevent us from losing 5-0, 6-0. Imagine what would it be like at Anfield should that happen. We might hear the biggest boos at Anfield and he might get sacked right away. I dare not mention RAWK............

[Floydy]

So after giving him a load of money in the summer for players, getting the backroom staff he wanted, it would definitely be a wise move to start thinking about fucking him off after the first defeat.

Maybe this fella put that plan in place.



"I know what we`ll do, back Rodgers to the hilt in the summer then start the process of fucking him off after four games in. All in favour say aye"

John I see your point I really do, and I don't think any true fan wants to see him sacked and want him to do well as it means the club is doing well.  But a lot of the posters here and fans in the ground or in the pubs in Liverpool, London or Lebanon are mindful of simply ignoring glaring mistakes in the belief that it somehow goes against this great club and its traditions.    We all see things differently and the pressure was always on BR this season, he himself knows it, FSG knows it and all the fanbase knows it.  Lets not pretend otherwise.   Yes it is early days but excuses cant keep getting made we are well into BR's philosophy, project that he spoke so passionaltely about in June 2012.  But as fans we haven't seen any produce.    The total transfer amount is laughable, the individual signings in the main have been very questionable and still we have no clear direction .  We are nowhere near where we want to be despite being 3 seasons , several transfer windows, and over £300m spent.     

At what point does enough become enough ?    (and im not suggesting that he should be sacked now), but genuine question   where do we draw the line.

[Fordy]

Four games in, one defeat and you advocate change of the manager? Not suprising from you is it? First sign of a problem and your in there, feet first.

It`s also guess work on your part to expect another manager to come in and work wonders.

Coulda, woulda, shoulda.

Paint that target and attack.

4 seasons and 300millon later.
It's not about 4 games when we have only played good for 45 minutes.

[Simplexity]

John I see your point I really do, and I don't think any true fan wants to see him sacked and want him to do well as it means the club is doing well.  But a lot of the posters here and fans in the ground or in the pubs in Liverpool, London or Lebanon are mindful of simply ignoring glaring mistakes in the belief that it somehow goes against this great club and its traditions.    We all see things differently and the pressure was always on BR this season, he himself knows it, FSG knows it and all the fanbase knows it.  Lets not pretend otherwise.   Yes it is early days but excuses cant keep getting made we are well into BR's philosophy, project that he spoke so passionaltely about in June 2012.  But as fans we haven't seen any produce.    The total transfer amount is laughable, the individual signings in the main have been very questionable and still we have no clear direction .  We are nowhere near where we want to be despite being 3 seasons , several transfer windows, and over £300m spent.     

At what point does enough become enough ?    (and im not suggesting that he should be sacked now), but genuine question   where do we draw the line.

He has to achieve something this year, if we end up like last season there is absolutely no way back.

[L666KOP]

   

At what point does enough become enough ?    (and im not suggesting that he should be sacked now), but genuine question   where do we draw the line.

His fate will be decided next May.

I'd be surprised if he went before.

No way are FSG daft enough to spend what we did in the summer if he's going at the first sign of trouble.

[TheTeflonJohn]

John I see your point I really do, and I don't think any true fan wants to see him sacked and want him to do well as it means the club is doing well.  But a lot of the posters here and fans in the ground or in the pubs in Liverpool, London or Lebanon are mindful of simply ignoring glaring mistakes in the belief that it somehow goes against this great club and its traditions.    We all see things differently and the pressure was always on BR this season, he himself knows it, FSG knows it and all the fanbase knows it.  Lets not pretend otherwise.   Yes it is early days but excuses cant keep getting made we are well into BR's philosophy, project that he spoke so passionaltely about in June 2012.  But as fans we haven't seen any produce.    The total transfer amount is laughable, the individual signings in the main have been very questionable and still we have no clear direction .  We are nowhere near where we want to be despite being 3 seasons , several transfer windows, and over £300m spent.     

At what point does enough become enough ?    (and im not suggesting that he should be sacked now), but genuine question   where do we draw the line.

Some good points there Paul and I agree with a few of them. I personally don`t know if Brendan is the right man, he does make some strange decisions, tactically/ substitutions etc.

For me mate, he should get to see this season out after the overhaul of the club this summer and if things don`t change then yeah lets think about changing the manager.

Just think it`s plain stupid to rip it all up  after four games.

[Floydy]

Who knows?

The fact remains, it would be pretty fucking stupid to put all these plans in place this summer then start to rip it all up after the first defeat.

Doesn't Rodgers himself keep ripping things up and starting again though seemingly?  Not 1 of his 3 full seasons have been similar in our play. There appears to be now development whasoever, everything seems to hinge on who we buy innthe window, then 12 months down the line, the players are bombed out (Borini, Balo, Lambert, Sahin, Asaidi, Aspas, Sakho, Alberto, Moreno, Cissokho)    To me looking back now over his tenure everything seems a little improvised and off the cuff.   That type of approach wont get us anywhere.       Cant remember who it was but they stated that you don't buy a team of champions they grow into champions.     We have no nucleus of key /young players playing a certain style , we seem to change as often as the winds direction and how can you plan for a team or develop a team with that approach?

[TheTeflonJohn]

4 seasons and 300millon later.
It's not about 4 games when we have only played good for 45 minutes.

It is about four games though after the massive overhaul of the club this summer (backroom staff and playing staff).

[thelinnen]

For what it's worth I don't think Brendan is a great manager, and Saturday showed that.

He doesn't have the perspective to see the forest through the trees. He uses an 'if it's not broke don't fix it' approach to team selection. The same team got a point against Arsenal so lets pick them again. Put it quite simply we didn't need Lucas on the pitch in a game where we would have most of the ball, Moreno should've come in for Gomez as we have had nothing down the left in four games now, and his decision to justify the Lovren purchase was always going to result in something like this.

Compare him to someone like Rafa for example. He sets up his team every game with the opposition in mind. He analyses every flaw that his team could exploit, and considers how they could exploit his teams weaknesses. Everyone knew what West Ham were going to do on Saturday based on their game against Arsenal. They were going to look for an early goal, probably from a defensive error, and then park the bus for the rest of the game and hit us on the counter. We then give away an incredibly cheap goal and have no reply to it, when we should've been keeping the game cagey for the first 20 minutes or so. Chelsea did exactly the same sort of snatch and grab against us to stop us winning the league, and two seasons later we're still falling for it. We have no plan B when a team comes to Anfield and plays us on the counter.

I think Brendan likes to take the 'let the opposition worry about what we're going to do' approach to matches like West Ham at home. It's ok when you've got a team like Ferguson's United, or players like Suarez and Sturridge up front, but the truth is we aren't good enough to play like that. For the record I think he would win the league in style with Manchester City's squad, but I don't think we'll ever be that strong up front again.

[firing squad]

Go on then, entertain me.

The last backroom staff is the one he wanted, which is why he brought them with him.  They were fired because someone had to be fired after that clustefuck of a season.

[TheTeflonJohn]

The last backroom staff is the one he wanted, which is why he brought them with him.  They were fired because someone had to be fired after that clustefuck of a season.

I was pointing the he has a new backroom staff this summer.

[TealC]

Is it me or have we had 4 years of transition under BR?

we will probably continue to be in transition as long as BR is manager here.

I don't think he will make the right decisions when it comes to building a strong spine. And thats why we will be in transition all the time

[thegoodfella]

For what's it worth, there's no other option but to stick to the manager, the staff and the team for the rest of the season, for better or for worse.

[Simplexity]

For what's it worth, there's no other option but to stick to the manager, the staff and the team for the rest of the season, for better or for worse.

Yeah can't really do much now, we just have to live with it.

[firing squad]

I was pointing the he has a new backroom staff this summer.

And yet the team has exactly the same problems.  Hmm..

[Floydy]

The last backroom staff is the one he wanted, which is why he brought them with him.  They were fired because someone had to be fired after that clustefuck of a season.

In that logic though the manager should have walked.      In many ways is the backroom and assistans that can provide that stability to a new manager, they know the club, the players , the fans etc.  When has a backroom team ever been fired for a poor season and the manager kept in place?
It reeked of a blame game being played behind the scenes which does not bode well.  The fact that a DOF was fucked off and a TC brought in, then  a TC being criticised and the back room getting fucked off.  Somebody keeps dodging the bullets, certain players are being spared the bullet, the manager spared the bullet but yet bullets are being fired.   Question is are the bullets finding the right targets?   results and performances suggest not.

[firing squad]

In that logic though the manager should have walked.      In many ways is the backroom and assistans that can provide that stability to a new manager, they know the club, the players , the fans etc.  When has a backroom team ever been fired for a poor season and the manager kept in place?
It reeked of a blame game being played behind the scenes which does not bode well.  The fact that a DOF was fucked off and a TC brought in, then  a TC being criticised and the back room getting fucked off.  Somebody keeps dodging the bullets, certain players are being spared the bullet, the manager spared the bullet but yet bullets are being fired.   Question is are the bullets finding the right targets?   results and performances suggest not.

Agreed.

[KirkVanHouten]

Is it me or have we had 4 years of transition under BR?

Nah it's been 3 years of transition. One year we were ahead of schedule and we promptly corrected that.

[Floydy]

Yeah can't really do much now, we just have to live with it.

This is how ive been feeling since we sacked Rafa. How long do we keep sitting back and saying ' oh well, its the LFC way' or ' what can we do about it now?


where will this passive attitude get the club?  fucking nowhere and fast.

[Max_powers]

That was a real bad defeat and a very poor performance but some you don't half go overboard with the negativity. Here is some perspective after 4 games we are on 7 points, same number of points as Manchester United and Arsenal and ahead of likes of Chelsea and Spurs. Its not a great start but its not a bad one either.  The thing is its way too early to tell who is going to finish in top 4 and who is going to miss out. I expect all of the top teams to improve including us, but right now they aren't looking much better than us. As long as we are in touching distance of 4th by early December I think Rodgers should be given the season. Pretty much every season under him our performances and results in second half of the season have been much better than the first. So I do expect us be inconsistent up until December.

[Max_powers]

This is how ive been feeling since we sacked Rafa. How long do we keep sitting back and saying ' oh well, its the LFC way' or ' what can we do about it now?


where will this passive attitude get the club?  fucking nowhere and fast.

I know right we should be sacking managers 4 games into the season, that is the kind of foundations successful teams are built on.

[adamski29]

We've only scored more than 1 goal TWICE in the last 14 league matches.

Liverpool 0-3 West Ham
Arsenal 0-0 Liverpool
Liverpool 1-0 B'mouth
Stoke 0-1 Liverpool
Stoke 6-1 Liverpool
Liverpool 1-3 Palace
Chelsea 1-1 Liverpool
Liverpool 2-1 QPR
Hull 1-0 Liverpool
WBA 0-0 Liverpool
Liverpool 2-0 Newcastle
Arsenal 4-1 Liverpool
Liverpool 1-2 Man United
Swansea 0-1 Liverpool

That is truly worrying.

Aye! That it is and Newcastle were gone on there holidays.

[Chakan]

I know right we should be sacking managers 4 games into the season, that is the kind of foundations successful teams are built on.

He's been here for only 4 games?

[SMASHerano]

I know right we should be sacking managers 4 games into the season, that is the kind of foundations successful teams are built on.

No, we should be sacking managers after 3 years of failing to win 1 trophy out of an available 12.

Why do the superfans keep thinking that we're only looking at the past 4 games only?

[Floydy]

I know right we should be sacking managers 4 games into the season, that is the kind of foundations successful teams are built on.

cuntish remark.

[BER]

Rodgers is a lame duck, has been since he agreed to have his backroom staff thrown under the bus. That showed a lack of character on his part too and the players will be thinking this also. There's 0% chance he comes out of this now, whole thing is a complete shit show.