Topic: It's important to win... but more important not to lose.

[fowlerisgod96]

Skrtel over Agger says it all for me.

[Tom_B]

Skrtel over Agger says it all for me.

I've brought up that point before. It is similar to the Barry over Xabi plans I guess.

[killer-heels]

Our problems go deeper than a switch round of players but Insua is the kind of player, like Agger, who can help us when we're not winning and are seemingly happy to sit back on the draw.

This has been brewing in me for a while now and rather than start a new thread I'll post it here, since we're talking about missing links (not phil neville). I've made sure to take the time to watch how we play, stretching to the arse end of last season.

You can't put our problems down to one position or one player you have to look at the team as an entity.
Yes we do have a problem, now we'll get the "We're in 2nd, we're challenging for the title" brigade in their legions saying we don't have a problem, but anybody who watches us on a regular basis can see we're struggling, and we have done for a long time (not just this season) in a certain type of match.

It'd be counter productive and not in the Liverpool way at all not to look for ways our team could improve and could be playing better, if you don't then the title passes you by while other teams improve and address their problems. Seemingly a load of our fans have been blinded by the light when looking up from the top of the mountain, unaware we're perilously close to the cliff ledge.

Anyway cracking on (I hate long posts and hardly ever read them) the lad has raised a good point, and it's why are we better with the likes of Insua in the team, and I'll add to this (as will the stats, only one 0-0 between both players) Agger.

The answer is freedom.

I'm not on about total football here, where everybody has every position but a move away from the mechanical and drilled team we've seen under Rafa.  The higher we climb the more rigid we become. I firmly believe this is a direct cause of the system Rafa employs.
Now you'll get both groups wading in both wanting to crucify or coronate Rafa, when the real truth lies somewhere in the middle.  He's a great manager but he's not perfect, he's no Barack Obama, and results over the last 2 seasons, and even from his time in Spain have shown he has a weakness.

The weakness is well known.  Breaking down teams, especially teams with massive numbers behind the ball. I think there is a solution though.

Our problem comes from players being tethered to a spot on the pitch and given a radius of around 6 foot to do their work.  Those who do express creative freedom are either one of the 2 per match allowed to (Torres, Gerrard) or will find their arse with splinters the next (Agger).

Shankly said it best:
"Football is a simple game complicated by idiots"
That man knew his stuff and although you could never call Rafa and idiot, far from it, he does tend to overcomplicate the matter. 

We were revolutionised under a simply philosophy, "Pass and Move".
Pass and move died years ago, from the anti-football of Souness, to the dribble whenever you can Spice Boys, to the counter attacking of Houllier, and now to the military regiment that is Rafa's XI.

I'm not saying we destroy what Rafa has created but the more Rafa is here the more constricted our players become. If Rafa is still here in 5 years time I wouldn't be surprised to see eleven robots on the pitch.

Some people argue it won't work in modern football and to that I say bollocks. 
As much as we hate them the Mancs were so successful last year because of their freedom in front of the middle 2.

The quartet of Giggs, Rooney, Tevez, and Ronaldo were all allowed to drift in and out of each others positions, never becoming stuck against one defender and constantly probing the opposition's back line.
Their problem this year has come from having a player that can only play in one position, Berbatov is too slow to not play anywhere other than in the middle of the park up the top.
It badly set back their team and gave defences a much easier time, they knew what was coming and where it was coming from, there was no interchange and no freedom and they suffered from alot of the problems we do now.

Again this season the team leading the way is Barcelona.
They have a selection of Busquets/Toure and even at times Keita defending anything coming through the middle while in front of them Messi, Henry, and Eto'o are allowed to roam free while Xavi pulls the strings and keeps it all together (Iniesta can also fill in this role).

It's meant they're the quickest to ever reach 50 points in Spain (alright they have class players) but they've done it scoring 85 goals in all competitions this season and only conceding 13 in the league.

Watch how many people end up in the box off any attack, they are safe in the knowledge that should they lose the ball it will be recovered.

Edit: And before you watch it try to count along with how many players are in the box supporting attacks, and ask when the ball is played out from the back could Xabi, Agger, Insua do this? Course they could.

1st half highlights
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/ThXFFl6MC_4&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/ThXFFl6MC_4&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1</a>

2nd half highlights
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/FERR9PmnRKs&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/FERR9PmnRKs&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1</a>

I'm not saying we need to be Barcelona but we have the players that would allow the team the creative freedom we so desperately need.
Agger brings out it exceptionally well from the back linking the defence to the midfield, Alonso is great in the tackle but can spray the ball, doing a Xavi style job orchestrating what is in front of him, we have Mascherano who has had fuck all to do this season because of our sit back attitude, and we have Torres, Gerrard, and Keane who can all score goals.

It was worst exemplified at Stoke. We're 0-0 and playing passes to the back, long balls up front, and our front men aren't moving laterally at all because they're told they must be tracking back and helping the fella behind them.

We don't just have zonal marking on corners we have it in open play, you can tell they each have their own segment to mark and they're scared to abandon it.
No freedom at all.

What we need is an attitude change.
Our team go out with the primary goal of not losing, that much is clear, that's how they're set out, that's how they play, if a win comes it's in spite of our style.  A goal from Torres, a goal from Stevie.

I'll ask you this, on Sunday count how many players are in the box when our attack finishes, I can tell you now it's 2 at most.
It also seems pretty obvious Mascherano will play, I'll ask you to do this, keep an eye on him and what he has to do.  His best asset is his tenacity, to chase players all over the pitch and reclaim the ball.  If we again play with 2 holding players we'll see Mascherano once more looking around at other people doing the work he's there to do rather than doing what they should be doing (Kuyt).

Bring back pass and move, give the lads in the final third some freedom, and go out to win the match.

That was an excellent post Degs. The problem with that is that although Rafa likes a fairly rigid system, im sure he isnt so dictatorial in that he restricts the front players from moving around and having such freedom. I mean, Benayoun usually has a wander from the right and you see him pop up in the centre as well.

The problem with that Barca video is clear, its all about personnel. Firstly, I saw Henry, Eto, Messi as their main attackers (let me know if i missed anyone out) and they were backed up by Xavi and Alves from full back. Now who in our team is in that class in terms of attacking? Only Gerrard and Torres. You cant assume that inferior players like Babel, Riera, Kuyt and Benayoun are automatically going to play the kind of attacking football that Barcelona play.

Secondly, how quick are some of those players? Very. People say pace doesnt matter. But you need some pace. We cant play many passes into space and channels because you know that the likes of Aurelio, Arbeloa, Kuyt, Yossi and Riera wont reach it. They are far too clunky and too slow.

Thirdly, how sad is it that we missed out on Daniel Alves? Then again, I guess within a few posts someone will say that they prefer Arbeloa because he is better defensively and we much rather have a defensively sound full back than an attacking full back!

Which illustrates Juan Loco's point brilliantly. We look for defensive contributions from our attackers, Man Utd look for attacking contributions from their defenders! The latter point applies to Barca as well

[jckliew]

Draws will be the death of us and the death nail of Rafa. If we don't learn that we have to score the 2nd goal then nights like this will happen again, again and again.

Bump*

[jckliew]

Rafas is instinctively defensive and uninstinctively..........thats the reason when the chips are down for a goal, you cant get one through his rigid system with easy as the players are brianwashed to be defensive

[Мерфи]

Don't know why, but my post during the match thread was erased - I was remarking that right around the time we scored, we still were not looking convincing. 

To be perfectly honest - we have played rather "efficient" football all year - and now, at the beginning of the business end of the season, that "efficiency" is coming back to bite us.  Rafa wants to control the game, which is fine when you are two up in a game - but we play this maddening style of football where the back 8 pass the ball back and forth, working the ball up the field slowly.  No real creativity, just a ruthless efficiency, which is meant to create half chances, and hopes on the brilliance of one or two players (Torres, Gerrard) to take advantage of those half chances.  It doesn't matter if we are facing Chelsea or West Brom - It always the same style.

I've been a huge fan of Kuyt - but it is this ruthless efficiency and plodding determination which is now plaguing our team.  The League is full of teams looking to plod on with determination - Especially the lower league teams - who would just as soon not step foot in the attacking end of the field as long as they take a point from the top of the table sides in order to stay up in Premiership.  In individual players, this dogged determination is appreciated and applaudible, but does nothing to set our team apart from our competitors.  Instead we get this efficient football, with no real life behind the team.  And right now, our results reflect that rather lifeless approach to the game.

I support Rafa - Under his reign we have become a factor in world football, we have won things, and we will continue to be relevant under his lead- but something has to change.  It is stick or twist time.  And it goes like this.  We either stick with Rafa and give him control over the team that he wants (finding players he feels will fit his "efficient" style of play, but whose efficiency truly sets them apart) as he has stated in his contract request . . . or we twist - and find a manager who can now motivate the spine of this team to set themselves apart.

I think there is still something to be said for fielding a ruthlessly efficient side.  Its a big "what if" but I think we very well could still be at the top of the table had Rafa landed his number one target over the summer in Gareth Barry, instead of getting what now looks like a square peg for a round hole in Robbie Keane.  Surely Rafa would have had, in Barry, some one with efficiency to control the center of the field that Lucas just isn't able to give us (yet?).  Someone who is truly box to box while allowing Gerrard to attack, and allow Alonso and/or Mascherano to lay back.

I can accept maddening football, as long as there is an end product - And right now - There is no end product.  There is only, what if.

[Callaghan.]

isn't the title of this thread saying the opposite of what the thread-starter is trying to say? wots up wi dat?

[fowler_is_god9]

Don't know why, but my post during the match thread was erased - I was remarking that right around the time we scored, we still were not looking convincing. 

To be perfectly honest - we have played rather "efficient" football all year - and now, at the beginning of the business end of the season, that "efficiency" is coming back to bite us.  Rafa wants to control the game, which is fine when you are two up in a game - but we play this maddening style of football where the back 8 pass the ball back and forth, working the ball up the field slowly.  No real creativity, just a ruthless efficiency, which is meant to create half chances, and hopes on the brilliance of one or two players (Torres, Gerrard) to take advantage of those half chances.  It doesn't matter if we are facing Chelsea or West Brom - It always the same style.

I've been a huge fan of Kuyt - but it is this ruthless efficiency and plodding determination which is now plaguing our team.  The League is full of teams looking to plod on with determination - Especially the lower league teams - who would just as soon not step foot in the attacking end of the field as long as they take a point from the top of the table sides in order to stay up in Premier League.  In individual players, this dogged determination is appreciated and applaudible, but does nothing to set our team apart from our competitors.  Instead we get this efficient football, with no real life behind the team.  And right now, our results reflect that rather lifeless approach to the game.

I support Rafa - Under his reign we have become a factor in world football, we have won things, and we will continue to be relevant under his lead- but something has to change.  It is stick or twist time.  And it goes like this.  We either stick with Rafa and give him control over the team that he wants (finding players he feels will fit his "efficient" style of play, but whose efficiency truly sets them apart) as he has stated in his contract request . . . or we twist - and find a manager who can now motivate the spine of this team to set themselves apart.

I think there is still something to be said for fielding a ruthlessly efficient side.  Its a big "what if" but I think we very well could still be at the top of the table had Rafa landed his number one target over the summer in Gareth Barry, instead of getting what now looks like a square peg for a round hole in Robbie Keane.  Surely Rafa would have had, in Barry, some one with efficiency to control the center of the field that Lucas just isn't able to give us (yet?).  Someone who is truly box to box while allowing Gerrard to attack, and allow Alonso and/or Mascherano to lay back.

I can accept maddening football, as long as there is an end product - And right now - There is no end product.  There is only, what if.

Some of this is right some of this is wrong.  We do play methodically from the back coming forward with numerous passes with very little creativity.  Making half chances with the hope that someone usually Gerrard or Torres will come with one bit of class.  And for me we will never win the league playing that style.

The answer to this is not to sign another centre mid.  How can people not see that this isn't where the problem is.  Straight away, playing one one up front reduces the amount of chances we have.  The second thing is playing Kuyt.  You play him anywhere and you get effort and committment, but what other side asks for this from their right mid?  Surely this is the job of the centre mids?  Especially if there is three of them.

We keep the ball better than any side in Europe because of our style of play but we sacrifice creativity due to it.

You mention that if we had bought Barry instead of Keane we would still be top of the league.  We wouldn't have been top of the league in the first place because Kuyt would have been up front on his own for half the season.  And before 100 people jump down my throat shouting Newcastle.  For every Newcastle there is a Stoke, West Ham and Hull.

More attacking tactics with more attacking players will mean less draws a lot more wins and probably a few more losses but overall more points.

[keyo]

More attacking tactics with more attacking players will mean less draws a lot more wins and probably a few more losses but overall more points.

i think maybe we are in danger of throwing out the baby with the bathwater when we talk about changing tactics......what we need is to build on our play to improve our results by playing to our strengths and enhancing them somewhat.......we do keep the ball as well as anyone in the league, our passing is good and when we lose the ball we are excellent at getting it back

what we need to do is to enhance that and i can see 2 ways that we can do that, both of which are in our locker and we have used successfully before.....firstly, increasing our tempo, quicker passing and greater movement and possibly the use of our more pacy players (torres, gerrard obviously but babel and ngog at times), and varying our tempo too to maintain control, this way we can control games but also "take teams on" more......the second is to compress the game into the opposition half, pressing their backline and midfield when they have the ball, so that when we do win the ball back a break can be started from a much more dangerous position.

we used to hunt down the opposition, going back as far as momo, when we changed the defensive midfielder role from didi's calm assurance to one that pursued the opposition.....mascherano has not had the best season, but he can do the job of hunting the opposition down better than anyone in the game

you can only score when you have the ball and men in and around the opposition box (unless you are xabi)......this is what we need to do to really ram home are advantage in games more often

[fowler_is_god9]

i think maybe we are in danger of throwing out the baby with the bathwater when we talk about changing tactics......what we need is to build on our play to improve our results by playing to our strengths and enhancing them somewhat.......we do keep the ball as well as anyone in the league, our passing is good and when we lose the ball we are excellent at getting it back

what we need to do is to enhance that and i can see 2 ways that we can do that, both of which are in our locker and we have used successfully before.....firstly, increasing our tempo, quicker passing and greater movement and possibly the use of our more pacy players (torres, gerrard obviously but babel and ngog at times), and varying our tempo too to maintain control, this way we can control games but also "take teams on" more......the second is to compress the game into the opposition half, pressing their backline and midfield when they have the ball, so that when we do win the ball back a break can be started from a much more dangerous position.

we used to hunt down the opposition, going back as far as momo, when we changed the defensive midfielder role from didi's calm assurance to one that pursued the opposition.....mascherano has not had the best season, but he can do the job of hunting the opposition down better than anyone in the game

you can only score when you have the ball and men in and around the opposition box (unless you are xabi)......this is what we need to do to really ram home are advantage in games more often

Too much of this is hypothetical aboout movement etc.  When you actually watch the game and Benitez's decisions it goes beyond this.  The fact is in most games the opposition surrender the possession to us.  So straight hunting people down etc isn't an option as they don't have the ball to hunt down.  Quicker movement is all well and good but when you have got 2 centre mids sitting either behind or alongside the ball it reduces the amount of options going forward.

What makes this even worse is when Gerrard picks the ball up he has only Torres or whoever is playing lone striker in front of him that could be played into a goal scoring position.  The problem with this is that one centre half can stand on torres and the other can hang back in case the ball or the player gets past the centre half.

It's the formation that make us play the way we do.  It's great that we have so much possession but it is this exact reason why we create very little chances.  It's because we very rarely play the risky pass because the risky pass is rarely on.

Benitez then takes this further by employing defensive minded players in the offensive positions.  The crowd being the brainless zombies they are don't help either.  You get players like Reira who are there to try and make things happen.  Run at players and create opportunities.  The problem with it is a symptom of doing what players like Reira are meant to do is that they will give it away.  The fans go off their tits when it happens.  The same happens to Babel. The funny thing is the same pricks go mad when Kuyt holds the ball up and plays it square.  Benitez makes it worse by changing Reira for Babel when we're after a goal.  Rather than having two risk taker type players, he leaves Kuyt on.

[keyo]

movement and tempo is not hypothetical......there are plenty of occasions when our tempo has been high and the movement excellent......much more difficult against teams that sit deep but not impossible......we do tend to play in front of teams who sit and defend, and this appears to be a deliberate tactic to "clear the area" so as not to get too crowded and compress the game into where the opposition are, this is our problem, as it is a tactic then tends not to work if we do not get a goal early......so there are improvements to be made in terms of tactics employed.........compressing the game does have its benefits, getting men in and around the box will result in more opportunities from breaks, etc....mascherano winning a tackle and releasing torres at the same time against derby is a perfect example....

we have played with plenty of tempo at times - against the sides at the top like united at home and bottom like newcastle - but there are times when we have not played with enough tempo or the quality has been lacking, but to say it isn't there is just wrong

alonso and mascherano do play behind the ball, but both can be effective when playing in the opposition half (in mascherano's case an improvement in form would be required too) when in possession and when not in possession........other teams often do surrender alot of possession to us, but not in the last third, chasing possession there and compressing the game would result in greater pressure on the opposition defence, thereby creating more opportunities to exploit space, errors, etc.

we can do lots of things better, but i do not believe that we don't have the players or the manager to get these things right over time...our form will improve and we will get better results over the next 15 than in january

[Stef08]

All big teams have to overcome sides that park the bus. We should be good enough to break them down

[Shanks1965]

So today, when we score the first goal, let's watch closely to see what happens. Will we push on and look for the second goal or will we do as we did against Everton and sit back and risk conceding to a set peice or a late equaliser. We MUST go out with the attitude that we need to score 3 to win and if we do that we will.

[mainstandred]

3 points for liverpool or forget it today .

[Red Alert]

It is really simple, we have to go out with the attitude of 'lets batter every team we play' and win every game, and hope the Manure slip up a few times, or it is over for another season. Treat every game like Instanbul. 'We can do it and will do it' or roll over and hand it to them on a plate. It is time for players with big hearts and total commitment, nothing less.

[Shanks1965]

It is really simple, we have to go out with the attitude of 'lets batter every team we play' and win every game, and hope the the Mancs slip up a few times, or it is over for another season. Treat every game like Instanbul. 'We can do it and will do it' or roll over and hand it to them on a plate. It is time for players with big hearts and total commitment, nothing less.

I don't doubt anyone's committment to be honest. It's the mental attitude that needs tweaking just a bit. Score one, score two, then think about keeping what we have. We seem to think we have a good defense and are hard to beat which we are, but we're not hard to get a draw against. Compared to our friends down the Lancs who have just gone a long time without conceding a goal seem able to both win games AND keep clean sheets. Do they have a better defense than us? Or is it that even after they score a goal, they continue to play the game in the oppositions half of the field?

[xavidub]

If we can't beat City today, the way they are playing, we can forget about the league.

[Shanks1965]

So in the end, as we've known for months, the home draws cost us the title. So frustrating as we've had a hand on the title on a few occassions this season. Next season the priority has to be to turn those 7 home draws into at least 5 home wins and I do hope Rafa has now learned that all important leasson that its not how many you don't lose but how many you win that wins you the Premier League. For the second season running we have lost fewer games than United but they have finished above us. It's a simple lesson, well for me it is at least.

A mate of mine though said something quite interesting this morning when we were talking about the United Arsenal game. He remembered when we were playing the Gunners the other week and late on when we needed a goal to win the game Reinna went up for a corner. About the first time either of us could remember a Liverpool goalie doing that. His point was that why in the previous 7 home draws did we not show the same level or urgency to win the game and take similar chances? A salutory point I thought.

Motto for next season has to be.... "It's important not to lose but more important to bust a gut trying to win."

[impz]

So in the end, as we've known for months, the home draws cost us the title. So frustrating as we've had a hand on the title on a few occassions this season. Next season the priority has to be to turn those 8 home draws into at least 5 home wins and I do hope Rafa has now learned that all important leasson that its not how many you don't lose but how many you win that wins you the Premier League. For the second season running we have lost fewer games than United but they have finished above us. It's a simple lesson, well for me it is at least.

A mate of mine though said something quite interesting this morning when we were talking about the United Arsenal game. He remembered when we were playing the Gunners the other week and late on when we needed a goal to win the game Reinna went up for a corner. About the first time either of us could remember a Liverpool goalie doing that. His point was that why in the previous 7 home draws did we not show the same level or urgency to win the game and take similar chances? A salutory point I thought.

Motto for next season has to be.... "It's important not to lose but more important to bust a gut trying to win."

It's not just rafa that has to learn .. Also those who go to the game.. 

[Antony]

That topic title sums up why we haven't won the league

[TSC]

I can rem arguing with the eternal optimists aftert our disastrous draws who insisted draws were ok cos we had 'ponts in the bag' whereas UTD simply had games in hand.  They've been quiet lately.

Always posted back in Dec/Jan that the draws against shite teams would cost us.

I mean, we destroyed WHU last week.  How did they get a draw at Anfield?  Similar Fulham.

Feck it, I'm off to bed.

Next season fuck the draws.  Just go for it.  Take the odd defeat if it hapens.  Works for the mancs.  This team's good enough.

[AlanK]

I can rem arguing with the eternal optimists aftert our disastrous draws who insisted draws were ok cos we had 'ponts in the bag' whereas UTD simply had games in hand.  They've been quiet lately.

Always posted back in Dec/Jan that the draws against shite teams would cost us.

I mean, we destroyed WHU last week.  How did they get a draw at Anfield?  Similar Fulham.

Feck it, I'm off to bed.

Next season fuck the draws.  Just go for it.  Take the odd defeat if it hapens.  Works for the mancs.  This team's good enough.

Why don't you just stay in bed if the only thing you have to add is I told you so.

[TSC]

Why don't you just stay in bed if the only thing you have to add is I told you so.

Prob same reason you got up.  What do you want me to say?  I lied earlier in the season?

Would love to say I was wrong.

[AlanK]

Well you could have said nothing. This I told you so bullshit is all over the site today, what's the point in using the Mancs equalling our record to big yourself up?

[TSC]

Well you could have said nothing. This I told you so bullshit is all over the site today, what's the point in using the Mancs equalling our record to big yourself up?

Maybe it's because I'm fucking fuming at these c*nts winning it when the best team will come second.  And maybe it's because there is a realisation that our draws cost.

What's up your scrotum anyway?  What the fuck's it to you what I post you clown?  Fuck off.

[mooks]

Maybe it's because I'm fucking fuming at these c*nts winning it when the best team will come second.  And maybe it's because there is a realisation that our draws cost.

What's up your scrotum anyway?  What the fuck's it to you what I post you clown?  Fuck off.

Perhaps in one of your sane moments you will sit down to consider why exactly we drew those game at home.

Hint: it has nothing to do with Rafa not taking your advice

[LFC on tour]

Is it fuck.

Go all out for the attack and win 1 lose 1, is better than being cautious as fuck in two games and getting 2 0-0s.

[Guz-kop]

Why does not being good enough to win some games always equal not being adventurous enough? The mancs play controlled, balanced and strong football. They're nowhere near as exciting or free flowing as they were in 99 but it can be argued that the industry and strength of the likes of Park, Fletcher and Tevez allow their stars to pick their moments and Evra, Vidic and Ferdinand have been rocks at the back. It's not all about going gung ho.

As it is there were lots of times at the start of the season where we went all out to get the wins and did so against the likes of Man City, Wigan and Boro.

If we're playing away to Stoke and can barely pass the ball 5 yards in the opposition half then it's not just easy to enough to point the finger at "tactics". Yeah the home draws are going to cost us but it's not so simply as just going for it and expecting things to turn round suddenly. We need to buy quality to add to what we have already.

[TALBERT]

The second goal has fucked us over this season

Tottenham away is a prime example of this if we had got that second goal we would have won and not lost....

I reckon next season we can go the entire season unbeaten....

If you look at the two teams we lost against....

Boro away (well they won't be in the prem next season)

Tottenham away (the arival of 'arry lifted spurs and we were unlucky not to win)


Rafa needs to play all out attacking teams against the weak sides this is a must!!!!

+ next season hopefully we will have Torres and Gerrard playing together for all 38 games...

[jaffod]

^^^^^^
I think it is highly unlikely we will only lose 2 games next season, never mind go the whole season unbeaten. It is also unlikely we will beat Chelsea and the mancs home and away. It is unlikely we will go the whole season unbeaten at home.
 Not wanting to sound negative and suggest we can't win the league. Just stating facts. And the most obvious fact is what many on here have been saying, we have to go out against everybody at anfield and go for the fucking throat for 90 minutes. It really is that simple. Not many will live with this team if we do.
 Sacrifice Mascherano in a few of those games and bring in an extra attacking player.Nothing against Javier but he really isn't fucking needed against teams who 'park the bus'.
 Really fucked off today. Should have won it but fucking didn't.

[LFCfan4Life]

^^^^^^
I think it is highly unlikely we will only lose 2 games next season, never mind go the whole season unbeaten. It is also unlikely we will beat Chelsea and the mancs home and away. It is unlikely we will go the whole season unbeaten at home.

fucking hell

not even seen the teams for next season and all the Nostradamus type predictions are out in force

all those things are just as likely next season as they were this season

last season we drew against chelsea and arsenal twice and lost to the mancs this season we beat chelsea, beat the mancs and drew to arsenal next season i think we will tonk the whole fucking lot of them 

[jaffod]

^^^^
O.k. I'll revise my post. Next season we will beat every team in the prem home and away without conceding a fucking goal.Is that better?

Look, all I'm saying is that this season we have been exceptional in certain areas and it will be hard to reproduce it again next season. I'm not saying we can't/wont win the league.

All this talk of wiping the floor with everyone is bullshit. We have gone 3 years now without a trophy so let's just stay a bit fucking realistic eh?

I think we CAN win it next season but also recognise it's not going to be some fucking walk in the park like some people do.

[mooks]

^^^^
O.k. I'll revise my post. Next season we will beat every team in the prem home and away without conceding a fucking goal.Is that better?

Look, all I'm saying is that this season we have been exceptional in certain areas and it will be hard to reproduce it again next season. I'm not saying we can't/wont win the league.

All this talk of wiping the floor with everyone is bullshit. We have gone 3 years now without a trophy so let's just stay a bit fucking realistic eh?

I think we CAN win it next season but also recognise it's not going to be some fucking walk in the park like some people do.

That's right.

United are by far the favourites to retain the title next season.  The odds may come down, however, depending on their summer recruitments and sales.

[John C]

^^^^^^ I think it is highly unlikely we will only lose 2 games next season, never mind go the whole season unbeaten. It is also unlikely we will beat Chelsea and the mancs home and away. It is unlikely we will go the whole season unbeaten at home. Not wanting to sound negative and suggest we can't win the league. Just stating facts. And the most obvious fact is what many on here have been saying, we have to go out against everybody at anfield and go for the fucking throat for 90 minutes. It really is that simple. Not many will live with this team if we do. Sacrifice Mascherano in a few of those games and bring in an extra attacking player.Nothing against Javier but he really isn't fucking needed against teams who 'park the bus'. Really fucked off today. Should have won it but fucking didn't.

I agree with everything you say except for the Masch point. You need to appreciate what he does and what he can bring to a defensive and attacking team.
RAFA - "Aye Messi, when I bought you, you knew my philosophy, I want attacking football but you must track back. Don’t just fuck off with the ball taking 15 men on and not think about what's behind you".
MESSI - "Don't worry boss, Masch is behind me. That's why I have confidence to press forward and he said in the dressing room although he knows I'm a lazy twat he'll cover for me.

[jckliew]

First half of season:

a) make sure we do Not lose the game first and foremost
b) play in your positions fist and foremost and do NOT lose shape
c) Fullbacks are defenders first and foremost
d) CMs are defenders first and foremost


3rd part of season

a) Attack first and foremost- win games
b) Players like Dirk and Yossi are allowed to venture more into the last third and get outta of their primary positions- rotate your positons,,,,get into the 6 yard box!
c) Fullbacks are to support attacks as much as possible
d) CMs are work further upfield rather than in front of the CBs all the time

[lfc_bhoy]

First half of season:

a) make sure we do Not lose the game first and foremost
b) play in your positions fist and foremost and do NOT lose shape
c) Fullbacks are defenders first and foremost
d) CMs are defenders first and foremost


3rd part of season

a) Attack first and foremost- win games
b) Players like Dirk and Yossi are allowed to venture more into the last third and get outta of their primary positions- rotate your positons,,,,get into the 6 yard box!
c) Fullbacks are to support attacks as much as possible
d) CMs are work further upfield rather than in front of the CBs all the time

Didn't know we had a telepath in our midst?  What am I thinking right now?

[Alan_X]

So in the end, as we've known for months, the home draws cost us the title.

Funny I thought it was losing to Spurs and Boro... but then that doesn't fit with the programme.

[SMD]

Any one who thinks we can just go a season beating all the teams outside the top 4 is deluding themselves. Especially with Gerrard and Torres missing chunks of the season and Keane missing sitters.

[Shanks1965]

I reckon next season we can go the entire season unbeaten....

But that's the point isn't it? We could have gone un beaten this season by drawing both of those games that we lost, but we still wouldn't have won the league would we?

Take Wigan last Wednesday as an example. United had 4 attacking goal scorers on the pitch when they were one nil down. Once they equalised they continued to push forward for the winner. Of course it was a game they thought they had to win but the point is they did EXACTLY the same thing at Stoke away when they were drawing 0-0 before they scored the winner. Compare what we did at Stoke (apart from not playing very well). We finished the game with Robbie Keane still sat on the bench.

We have been fantastic in the run in and we have not only won games but won them well. There is no doubt that the tempo of our game has been raised because we have had to win EVERY game and once we scored the first goal we continued to push on to get a 2nd and a 3rd. That's what was missing in many of the games we did not win this season. In the games we drew we were not desperate enough to win and prepared to take chances to do so and that's what we have got to become to win the league.

The league table doesn't lie and the best team is not decided by who loses the least number of games.

[Shanks1965]

Didn't know we had a telepath in our midst?  What am I thinking right now?

The way we played is pretty well described by what he wrote.