Author Topic: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell  (Read 442762 times)

Offline lorenzo

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #720 on: October 31, 2016, 05:51:26 pm »
Frankenstein operation wasn't it?
Well it worked so...next up is Moreno

Offline simbo

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #721 on: October 31, 2016, 06:07:49 pm »
Flanno has had pretty much 2 years out and is still getting his fitness back. How about letting him have a run of games before criticising him? And Clyne is hardly attacking and Klopp seems to like him.

Clyne is way more attacking than flanno

Offline AaronSingh25

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #722 on: December 28, 2016, 09:55:44 am »
Could this lad be converted into a winger?

Of course it's a stretch to suggest so, but probably not a big a stretch as say getting Lallana to play the midfield role and do a 'Modric'.

When Moreno was a youngster he was a winger, but as time went on was pushed back into the defence. He has all the attributes - pace to get up and down, good in the recovery to get back, good tackler, good cross on him, and a good shot. Only flaw in the logic is he doesn't have the natural flair to play there, and that's tough to learn in the your 20s.

He simply doesn't have the intelligence, discipline, defensive capabilities as a standard full back - think that boat has long gone - but as winger, i wonder if he can come in and do a job for us? At the bare minimum to come on when we are holding a lead to shore up the flanks; his pace and recovery is vital to get up and down.

Shame he didn't get that goal yesterday, was a good block. On another note, he's been a brilliant professional and not moaned a bit. You can tell that Jurgen feels for him, with the amount of hugs he gets.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2016, 09:59:55 am by AaronSingh25 »

Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #723 on: December 28, 2016, 09:56:18 am »
Could this lad be converted into a winger?


No. Suspect he'll be sold next summer. For now, he's a useful option when Milner is injured/suspended and as an impact sub to allow someone to rest their legs.

Offline Severely

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #724 on: December 28, 2016, 10:15:18 am »
If he's happy to stay, I doubt he'll be sold. Milner looks like he could play left back for the next few years at least, and Moreno is still a good player. We only remember the poor patch of form that lost him his place, we don't remember the moments he showed how good he could be.
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Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #725 on: December 28, 2016, 10:29:10 am »
If he's happy to stay, I doubt he'll be sold. Milner looks like he could play left back for the next few years at least, and Moreno is still a good player. We only remember the poor patch of form that lost him his place, we don't remember the moments he showed how good he could be.

That's because the bad patches or moments of form overwhelmingly outweigh the good.

I remember him being responsible for the momentum swinging away from us in a European final. I remember him getting hooked in a domestic final because he lost Fernandinho of all people and was generally having a stinker. I remember him losing his head on the opening day of this season.

James Milner is 31 next week, he's not going to be able to play left back twice a week at the top level for a few more years. If we're in Europe next season as looks extremely likely then I personally don't want to have to rely on Alberto Moreno in any game of football that really matters.

Offline kasperoff

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #726 on: December 28, 2016, 10:36:23 am »
He looks like exactly they type of full-back Klopp would want going forwards, he's just terrible at defending 1-on-1 and is prone to rash and unorthodox challenges in and around the penalty area. He also small, which always counts against defenders (and players in general - I reckon that's one of the reasons Allen was sold).

I can see why Klopp would want to try to develop him. He needs major work on the defensive side of his game. We've not really seen him for a while. It would be interesting to see what the coaches have been able to do with him whilst he's been away.

I'm sure we'll get the chance over the next few weeks.
I think the same, can't stand him, but if you could have a £1million pound cheque or steve bruces head hollowed out and filled with pound coins which would you have?

Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #727 on: December 28, 2016, 10:43:16 am »
He looks like exactly they type of full-back Klopp would want going forwards, he's just terrible at defending 1-on-1 and is prone to rash and unorthodox challenges in and around the penalty area. He also small, which always counts against defenders (and players in general - I reckon that's one of the reasons Allen was sold).

I can see why Klopp would want to try to develop him. He needs major work on the defensive side of his game. We've not really seen him for a while. It would be interesting to see what the coaches have been able to do with him whilst he's been away.

I'm sure we'll get the chance over the next few weeks.

Didn't really looked like he'd developed much when he decided to jump in two footed on the edge of the area last night and the opponent was in as a result.

And that's him playing as a winger. Defensively, all he had to do was track and try to block passing angles. He couldn't even do that.

If Klopp fancied developing him that much I think he'd have used him at some point since Palace, where he actually played quite well by his standards. But he hadn't until last night. Two months of league football have passed him by and will continue to do so barring any disastrous injury to Milner which would remind everyone that he isn't good enough and any talk on the contrary suggests a very short memory.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2016, 10:45:32 am by LallanaInPyjamas »

Offline dudleyred

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #728 on: December 28, 2016, 11:48:23 am »
Expect him to start against Sunderland due to the scheduling, hence his appearance yesterday. Would have thought at 4-1 woodburn would have got a run out otherwise

Offline gatcliffe

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #729 on: December 28, 2016, 11:50:19 am »
Expect him to start against Sunderland due to the scheduling, hence his appearance yesterday. Would have thought at 4-1 woodburn would have got a run out otherwise
Who will he replace ? To be honest can not see him starting against Sunderland.
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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #730 on: December 28, 2016, 11:50:22 am »
I'd be surprised if we don't go back in for Chilwell at some point.

Like the idea of Moreno but there's no way he'll ever be regular in this team, the negatives far outweigh the positives.
If he's being asked to head the ball too frequently - which isn't exactly his specialty - it could affect his ear and cause an infection. Especially if the ball hits him on the ear directly.

Offline dudleyred

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #731 on: December 28, 2016, 11:53:08 am »
Who will he replace ? To be honest can not see him starting against Sunderland.

No one on form at all - just with two games in 48 hours I wouldn't be surprised to see him start - can't understand why he got a run yesterday otherwise

Offline Purple Red

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #732 on: December 28, 2016, 12:23:16 pm »
He simply doesn't have the intelligence, discipline, defensive capabilities as a standard full back - think that boat has long gone - but as winger, i wonder if he can come in and do a job for us?

Wingers, as do all footballers, need intelligence and discipline as well. It's a persistent myth that unintelligent and undisciplined footballers can be shoehorned into positions which have less defensive resonsibility. Good footballers, the type we need at Anfield, cannot get away with lacking these characteristics.

Offline AaronSingh25

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #733 on: December 28, 2016, 12:33:00 pm »
I'd be surprised if we don't go back in for Chilwell at some point.



Yes because he rejected us last season to sign a new contract with Leicester, and has now set the league on fire with ONE Premier League game.

Back to Moreno - his pace and recovery are his plus points. He'd be a valuable asset from the bench, when we are trying to hold onto a lead, and still playing a high line. Eg, against Bournemouth away - when they broke away and outnumbered us, and we couldn't get back quick enough. Moreno with his pace could have got back in there.

Surprised he hasn't been utilized more in that sense.

Offline AaronSingh25

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #734 on: December 28, 2016, 12:34:25 pm »
Wingers, as do all footballers, need intelligence and discipline as well. It's a persistent myth that unintelligent and undisciplined footballers can be shoehorned into positions which have less defensive resonsibility. Good footballers, the type we need at Anfield, cannot get away with lacking these characteristics.

I'd argue a winger needs less game intelligence than a defender or midfielder. They can be free spirits if you let them - with the sole proviso being they track back.

Offline Purple Red

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #735 on: December 28, 2016, 12:41:57 pm »
I'd argue a winger needs less game intelligence than a defender or midfielder. They can be free spirits if you let them - with the sole proviso being they track back.

Average wingers need less game intelligence than a defender or a midfielder - I agree. However, the standard of player we want at Anfield needs to be above average and that includes players on the wing. If you consider who plays on our advanced flanks - players like Coutinho, Mane and Firmino - these are players with an intelligent understanding of the game who are crucial to Klopp's system. Firmino drags defenders out of position, Coutinho inititates quick interplay and Mane checks his runs and reads the game. This separates us from lesser sides who employ players like Moreno who have no subtelty. Besides, given that we play a 4-3-3 system I would suggest that this is even more unsuitable for Moreno.

Offline mc_red22

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #736 on: December 28, 2016, 12:43:29 pm »
Yes because he rejected us last season to sign a new contract with Leicester, and has now set the league on fire with ONE Premier League game.

Back to Moreno - his pace and recovery are his plus points. He'd be a valuable asset from the bench, when we are trying to hold onto a lead, and still playing a high line. Eg, against Bournemouth away - when they broke away and outnumbered us, and we couldn't get back quick enough. Moreno with his pace could have got back in there.

Surprised he hasn't been utilized more in that sense.

He didn't reject us, we pulled out of the deal because they were asking for too much.

Offline El Lobo

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #737 on: December 28, 2016, 12:45:27 pm »
Yes because he rejected us last season to sign a new contract with Leicester, and has now set the league on fire with ONE Premier League game.

Of course you're right Aaron Singh, I should have checked with you first for the intricacies of our transfer dealings :(

Won't happen again Aaron, sorry.
If he's being asked to head the ball too frequently - which isn't exactly his specialty - it could affect his ear and cause an infection. Especially if the ball hits him on the ear directly.

Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #738 on: January 2, 2017, 06:10:08 pm »
Obviously Milner was booked but you'd assume Moreno was also brought on to provide fresh legs and added width but there's fuck all chance of him providing the latter when he's consistently already in an offside position when Firmino or a midfielder picks the ball up on his side of the pitch.

Quite why he was on set-pieces is beyond me too. It's embarrassing that this lad is one of the first we have to turn to from the bench.

Offline Caligula?

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #739 on: January 2, 2017, 06:19:19 pm »
Amazing that this thread is fast becoming bigger than the City one !

It was started in August, what's your point?  ???

Offline gatcliffe

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #740 on: January 2, 2017, 06:21:18 pm »
It was started in August, what's your point?  ???
Sorry on wrong page whoops !
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Offline RedEire

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #741 on: January 3, 2017, 02:13:28 pm »
Quite why he was on set-pieces is beyond me too. It's embarrassing that this lad is one of the first we have to turn to from the bench.

Couldn't get my head around him getting to take the set pieces, firmino for me should've been on them! This is the second time I've noticed when he has come on that he's on set pieces, his crosses during play have always been mostly erratic, I can't understand why he then gets put on set pieces.  :-\
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Offline CraigDS

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #742 on: January 3, 2017, 02:17:52 pm »
It's embarrassing that this lad is one of the first we have to turn to from the bench.

Given he has made 5 sub appearances in the league this season, 4 of which for 13 minutes or under (2 of those being 0 and 4 minutes), I'd say you'd find it extremely hard to argue that point you made above is correct.

Offline JustDan

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #743 on: January 3, 2017, 02:36:54 pm »
Quite why he was on set-pieces is beyond me too. It's embarrassing that this lad is one of the first we have to turn to from the bench.
He took the corner which resulted in our 2nd goal...  :wave

Offline Dubred

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #744 on: January 3, 2017, 02:45:13 pm »
He took the corner which resulted in our 2nd goal...  :wave

Was just about to say that  ;D To be fair was a really good corner.

Not sure I'd have him on free kicks but a left footer on that corner was great to see.

Offline harryc

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #745 on: January 3, 2017, 02:50:42 pm »
Thought he was ok yesterday and as mentioned put in a decent corner resulting in the Mane goal.

Offline rojo para la vida

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #746 on: June 23, 2017, 08:25:53 am »
I wake up to yet another photo of Alberto partying with our Brazilian lads who are becoming an increasingly important part of Klopp's plans.

My main sporting passion is our club but I've got a love of horse racing and sometimes in the UK but particularly in the USA, when there's a really special horse, to calm it down and give it the right psychological run up to a big race, they give them a pony that accompanies them everywhere and particularly to trot up to the starting line with. Seems to work really well too. I like Moreno. He looks like a Scouser and has the passion of one. There's not many times that you don't see our Brazilian lads without him, so I think he's become their pony.

Is it wise to get rid of him? Jokes aside, is there a possibility that this obviously decent footballer can improve his game, especially about what has to occur in that organ in the head?

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #747 on: June 23, 2017, 08:32:54 am »
He's got the ability to improve, however we also have the ability to buy someone who is much better already.

He's had the time and hasn't taken the chance so we move on.

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #748 on: June 23, 2017, 08:33:05 am »
Me thinks the glue factory is awaiting the arrival of a new pony
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Offline Purple Red

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #749 on: June 23, 2017, 09:04:47 am »
I wake up to yet another photo of Alberto partying with our Brazilian lads who are becoming an increasingly important part of Klopp's plans.

My main sporting passion is our club but I've got a love of horse racing and sometimes in the UK but particularly in the USA, when there's a really special horse, to calm it down and give it the right psychological run up to a big race, they give them a pony that accompanies them everywhere and particularly to trot up to the starting line with. Seems to work really well too. I like Moreno. He looks like a Scouser and has the passion of one. There's not many times that you don't see our Brazilian lads without him, so I think he's become their pony.

Is it wise to get rid of him? Jokes aside, is there a possibility that this obviously decent footballer can improve his game, especially about what has to occur in that organ in the head?
So we should keep paying Moreno hundreds of thousands of pounds because the Brazilian lads enjoy a beer with him? He's had his chance. Time to go.

Offline iamnant

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #750 on: June 23, 2017, 09:08:04 am »
Remember thinking our left back position was sorted for the years to come after that game at Spurs when he scored *that* goal. Bit sad how it's turned out but he's had several chances to realise he's a defender and not a winger, and he's really not twigged.
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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #751 on: June 23, 2017, 10:39:31 am »
Tremendous attitude and bags of talent, but really poor application. There is still a player there somewhere but whether there's a player that suits us remains to be seen. Nevertheless, he's had his opportunities and failed to deliver. It might be best if he moved on and there seems to be an acceptance that it might happen as long as a reasonable bid comes in. Clearly, he's not a bad guy at all to have in the dressing room, so barring the right bid, I think Klopp might even decide to keep the player.
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Offline JackWard33

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #752 on: June 23, 2017, 10:42:19 am »
Tremendous attitude and bags of talent, but really poor application. There is still a player there somewhere but whether there's a player that suits us remains to be seen. Nevertheless, he's had his opportunities and failed to deliver. It might be best if he moved on and there seems to be an acceptance that it might happen as long as a reasonable bid comes in. Clearly, he's not a bad guy at all to have in the dressing room, so barring the right bid, I think Klopp might even decide to keep the player.

Think people slip into binary caricature when talking about him ("he's shit" "he's a liability" basically) when he's actually a really effective attacking player running from deep.
Couldn't understand why we didn't use him more in the second half of the season when Milner struggled with the ball more than people on here admit and when we were facing teams that didn't want to attack and certainly weren't committing their own full backs forward
However the fact that we didn't use him almost certainly means he won't be here next year.

Offline disgraced cake

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #753 on: June 23, 2017, 10:45:01 am »
Keeping him would be a disaster for all parties. I was bombarded on the transfer board yesterday for saying I fucking hate him, but to move away from that opinion with a level head, keeping him would seriously be a very poor idea. 15 million would be brilliant for Liverpool, 3 years into his contract and only started 5 or 6 games this season iirc.

Maybe there is a player there, but I doubt it. Getting turfed by a 31 year old James Milner is hardly the ideal at 24 years old when he looked so promising at one stage.
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Offline Purple Red

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #754 on: June 23, 2017, 10:53:40 am »
Think people slip into binary caricature when talking about him ("he's shit" "he's a liability" basically) when he's actually a really effective attacking player running from deep.
Couldn't understand why we didn't use him more in the second half of the season when Milner struggled with the ball more than people on here admit and when we were facing teams that didn't want to attack and certainly weren't committing their own full backs forward
However the fact that we didn't use him almost certainly means he won't be here next year.

He can't cross or shoot - I don't know where this idea that he's an effective attacking player running from deep comes from. Clyne's attacking output can be inconsistent as well but nowhere near as much as Moreno's. The latter's end product is very rarely good.

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #755 on: June 23, 2017, 10:57:46 am »
He can't cross or shoot - I don't know where this idea that he's an effective attacking player running from deep comes from. Clyne's attacking output can be inconsistent as well but nowhere near as much as Moreno's. The latter's end product is very rarely good.

He fills you with false hope. He gets the ball, speeds the length of the pitch, gets in a good position, cocks up his cross, loses possession, runs back the length of the pitch, tries one of his scissors tackles, gives away a free kick........

We know what happens next.

Nice lad, needs a fresh challenge.

Offline disgraced cake

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #756 on: June 23, 2017, 10:58:24 am »
He can't cross or shoot - I don't know where this idea that he's an effective attacking player running from deep comes from. Clyne's attacking output can be inconsistent as well but nowhere near as much as Moreno's. The latter's end product is very rarely good.

Agreed. Always thought the idea he could attack was a myth myself. Mad that in 2 years of being in the first team I can remember one great moment of him going forward - the goal at Spurs. I'd rather a full back be defensively solid, even for a team like Liverpool who attack well, so I'm not blasting him if he can't go forward and produce every game, but it's just a massive myth that he contributed anything going forward.
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Offline JackWard33

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #757 on: June 23, 2017, 10:59:56 am »
He can't cross or shoot - I don't know where this idea that he's an effective attacking player running from deep comes from. Clyne's attacking output can be inconsistent as well but nowhere near as much as Moreno's. The latter's end product is very rarely good.

No point discussing it if you're start point is 'he can't cross or shoot'
Go and watch the tape of palace away this season if you think he can't be an effective attacking full back
Moot debate anyway as he won't be here next season but he'll be effective for someone next season

Offline Purple Red

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #758 on: June 23, 2017, 11:05:12 am »
No point discussing it if you're start point is 'he can't cross or shoot'
Go and watch the tape of palace away this season if you think he can't be an effective attacking full back
Moot debate anyway as he won't be here next season but he'll be effective for someone next season
Fair enough he can cross and shoot on occasion but he may as well not be able to given his levels of inconsistency at a club like Liverpool Football Club. The occasional good performance is not relevant. Good players are consistent players. You can have all the talent in the world but if you only display it once every ten games what's the point?

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Re: Alberto Moreno: Ghost in the Shell
« Reply #759 on: June 23, 2017, 11:12:11 am »
Still feel he can do very well but elsewhere, it take anything over £13m