Topic: The Tory party thread... epic fail lol

[Millie]

The Canary is not a credible source for anything.

[SP]

He can't even be sure if he has seen a pussy cat. How can you trust him to bear witness to anything?

[Redman0151]

https://twitter.com/BritishRedCross/status/817428060723150849

Red cross been called in to help in hospitals because the NHS is struggling so much

Fuck the Tory's and anybody who voted them

[filopastry]

https://twitter.com/BritishRedCross/status/817428060723150849

Red cross been called in to help in hospitals because the NHS is struggling so much

Fuck the Tory's and anybody who voted them

Yep, this one has been brewing for a while and they've shown fuck all interest in doing anything about it

[The Gulleysucker]

....
Fuck the Tory's and anybody who voted them

Fuck anyone who didn't vote Labour and thus contributed to letting the bastards in again.

[Redman0151]

Fuck anyone who didn't vote Labour and thus contributed to letting the bastards in again.

Including Lib dems?

[The Gulleysucker]

Including Lib dems?

Oh there's a special rung in Hell reserved for those bastards, really close in to the mummified but still moist sphincter of Cameron that they will all be condemned to lick repeatedly while incanting "We've got the power to make a difference!".

[Zeb]

So, people dying on trolleys in hospitals, and May decides to address mental health services - which are pretty much what NHS services denuded of funding for several years look like.

May said (using MIND's precis here):

For too long mental illness has been something of a hidden injustice in our country, shrouded in a completely unacceptable stigma and dangerously disregarded as a secondary issue to physical health. Yet left unaddressed, it destroys lives, it separates people from each other and deepens the divisions within our society. Changing this goes right to the heart of our humanity; to the heart of the kind of country we are, the values we share, the attitudes we hold and our determination to come together and support each other.

I'm glad that this is a values thing. Because otherwise how does shit like "'Punishments' for benefits claimants with mental health issues rocket, figures show" happen? Source (2015).

Not pissing on some sensible ideas with this. But my irony detector overloaded when I heard that the plans include:

New ways to ‘right the injustices’ people with mental health problems face. Currently people with mental health problems who are struggling with debt can be charged up to £300 by their GP to provide evidence of their mental health problems. The Department for Health will undertake a formal review of the ‘mental health debt form’, working with Money and Mental Health.

Which is great. But ignores why people are having to pay this in the first place.

Psychiatrist Dr Jed Boardman of the Royal College said that rather than encouraging people back into work, benefit sanctions “can lead to people’s mental health conditions deteriorating, pushing them even further from work”.

He said: “The Royal College of Psychiatrists would support plans to change the current ESA system, which is unfair and prejudicial to many people with mental health problems.

“We know that what works for people with mental health conditions is a system of long term support into work, rather than threats and sanctions which are unjust and ineffective and can lead to people’s mental health conditions deteriorating, pushing them even further from work.

“We need to see a fundamental change of the process, so that people are reliably assessed so they can receive the support they need.”

Source (2016)

Ho-hum. But I hope some of the ideas at least are adequately funded and help those targeted. I've taken part in studies to help develop online therapies and support for bipolar (the Spectrum Centre at University of Lancaster is super) and, as long as we don't all pretend one thing is going to work for everyone even with the same diagnosis, then options are definitely a good thing.

[TepidT2O]

Ahh the NHS problems are all the fault of the public...


Good old Hunt eh?  Nailed those bastards there

[Anfield Ed]

Including Lib dems?

Definitely.

[SP]

Fuck anyone who didn't vote Labour and thus contributed to letting the bastards in again.

What about the people in the Buckingham constituency who did not vote Labour? Or the people who voted Green in Brighton?

[Libertine]

Fuck anyone who didn't vote Labour and thus contributed to letting the bastards in again.

Actually, what allowed the Tories to get a majority was the unexpected decimation of the Lib Dem PP despite the expected collapse in its support. It was widely believed that many Lib Dem MPs, particularly in the south and southwest, would buck national trends and hold their seats, giving the party something in the range of 20-30 seats, and therefore denying the Tories a majority. In the end, the Tories managed to squeeze them more than even they themselves expected and gained many of these seats. So, anyone who voted Labour instead of Lib Dem in these seats (and it's likely many will have switched between 2010 and 2015) essentially helped the Tories get a majority in parliament.

[TravisBickle]

Actually, what allowed the Tories to get a majority was the unexpected decimation of the Lib Dem PP despite the expected collapse in its support. It was widely believed that many Lib Dem MPs, particularly in the south and southwest, would buck national trends and hold their seats, giving the party something in the range of 20-30 seats, and therefore denying the Tories a majority. In the end, the Tories managed to squeeze them more than even they themselves expected and gained many of these seats. So, anyone who voted Labour instead of Lib Dem in these seats (and it's likely many will have switched between 2010 and 2015) essentially helped the Tories get a majority in parliament.

 It's funny, Labour's entire electoral strategy was based on disgruntled Lib Dem voters backing Miliband and depriving the Tories of a majority whilst simultaneously boosting Labour's vote. Contrary to what a lot of commentators say, there was a big flow from the Lib Dem votes to Labour, it just wasn't in the seats Labour needed. Down south, where the "Salmond controlling Miliband" line worked a treat (and where Miliband never really bothered to focus on), that was the crucial pattern which decided the election.

 Another crucial pattern was people switching outright from Labour to the Tories. They're the voters who won it for Blair, they're the voters who won it for Cameron and they're the voters who will decide future elections in this country.

[CornerFlag]

Tried to cut back on referring to Twitter but one of life's natural ballbags, Louise Mensch, is at it again.  This towards someone who's not 'of colour":

https://twitter.com/HannahMian/status/818523253815836674

[TravisBickle]

Tried to cut back on referring to Twitter but one of life's natural ballbags, Louise Mensch, is at it again.  This towards someone who's not 'of colour":

https://twitter.com/HannahMian/status/818523253815836674

 To be expected from someone who's easily one of the most revolting people in British politics. Thats if you can even say she's 'in' British politics at all given she fucked off to America the moment she got the chance? She's a truly dreadful human being in any case, just imagine telling someone what race they are... Utter bellend.

[SP]

Mensch is despicable. Does anyone need any further proof of that? Ignore her.

[TepidT2O]

Mensch is despicable. Does anyone need any further proof of that? Ignore her.

Very much a Katie Hopkins clone

She's making a career by making unpleasant remarks about people.

The only way to stop that is by not fueling the fire.

[CornerFlag]

I think the worst part of it all is that she believes that, because of freedoms of speech that are in place, you can literally just say any old shit that swings past the old grey matter.  I've been guilty of it before (on Twitter, it's such a dangerous reactionary platform (I wished someone would stab James Delingpole, before I knew who James Delingpole was)) but I've learned, thought about what to post before pressing the "Tweet" button.

Then you have your Mensch's and your Hopkins and your Holborn wankers who abuse the system, but you'll have people who see what they say and go "Oh wait, I can open my mouth and say whatever the fuck I want and hurt whoever I want with my words" with no real repercussions.  Only there is.  It's 2017 and those on the right can get away with saying an Asian person isn't Asian because on one picture their skin is lighter.  You can get away with (even be supported for) saying how migrants are cockroaches.  You can level jokes about horrific incidents without recrimination.  And because it's somehow cool to be anti-PC which becomes a proxy anti-establishment you get people too thick to realise what they're doing by trying to vote out the establishment by buying into the lies and propaganda of... the establishment.

I guess I'm just still seemingly shocked by it because of some naivety within me that the world is still a decent place.  But it's becoming less and less so.  We're born and raised these days to concentrate on yourself and those narrowly around you perhaps.  Fuck the guy struggling to afford his meds over the road, he's a burden to you, the Great British Taxpayer.  Fuck the single mum whose philandering ex has fucked off and left her feeding three kids on a part-time job because she's a drain on you, the Great British Taxpayer.  Fuck the immigrant who picks your strawberries in the summer because they're a bit different to you, the Great British Taxpayer.  Fuck the skilled nurses who earn under £35,000 a year and do nothing but help your underfunded healthcase system because you can just about afford to go private.

We NEED these fucking Tories not just out but gone.  Gone for good.

[So… Howard Philips]

That Twitter shite is just that. I don't understand why any intelligent person would waste their time communicating in a truncated manner with weirdos and proto-fascists.

[TepidT2O]

That Twitter shite is just that. I don't understand why any intelligent person would waste their time communicating in a truncated manner with weirdos and proto-fascists.

Many of us on here are on twitter too...


Ah... see your point...

[CornerFlag]

Many of us on here are on twitter too...


Ah... see your point...

Annoyingly more true than I wanted it to be.  More the former description than the latter I'd hope.

[TravisBickle]

That Twitter shite is just that. I don't understand why any intelligent person would waste their time communicating in a truncated manner with weirdos and proto-fascists.

 There are loads of great people to follow on Twitter to be fair. It's a good way of coming across informative journalism without having to switch between sites all the time trawling for it. I also use it as a way of getting different points of view (within reason of course) rather than convincing myself the whole world agrees with me because my timeline told me so.

 It is full of dickheads though, you're right.

[Libertine]

Home Secretary Amber Rudd's speech to the Conservative Party conference on foreign workers is being treated as a "hate incident" by police.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/home-secretary-amber-rudd-hate-crime-incident-speech-foreign-workers-police-tory-party-conference-a7523626.html

LOCK HER UP! LOCK HER UP!

[Redman0151]

Powerful front page from the Mirror

[west_london_red]

Powerful front page from the Mirror

That's absolutely heart-breaking. Everyone seems so obsessed with things like Brexit and Trump that we've taken our eyes off what is really important.

[Trada]

That's absolutely heart-breaking. Everyone seems so obsessed with things like Brexit and Trump that we've taken our eyes off what is really important.

I was listening to one doctor earlier and he saying someone went for a major operation took hours and afterwards they took the person back to their bed and someone else was already in it. took ages to find somewhere to put the person.

And saying someone was treated in a toilet.

[west_london_red]

Just seen that Tory run Surrey County Council want to raise Council tax by 15% because of the reductions in money it gets from the Tory government. It has to be put to a vote however so remains to be seen if it will go through but I suspect it won't be the only Council to hold such votes now.

[killer-heels]

Just seen that Tory run Surrey County Council want to raise Council tax by 15% because of the reductions in money it gets from the Tory government. It has to be put to a vote however so remains to be seen if it will go through but I suspect it won't be the only Council to hold such votes now.

Hope it goes through.

[west_london_red]

Hope it goes through.

Tories in a Tory area voting for a tax increase? Can't see it myself.

[SP]

Surrey is the most godawful council. It is a perma-Tory zone, and the services are shit. The Surrey suburbs are soulless at the best of times, but the council just offers the barest minimum.

[Zeb]

Liverpool took a 5.9% cut to spending power for 2015/16. Surrey came out with more money than they had before by 3.1%.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30537288

Not going to bet against emergency funding arriving miraculously in 'hard hit' Tory councils again. (Not denying they've made cuts and 'savings' too, just ridiculous the coverage Surrey are getting while the North is getting absolutely hammered.)

[killer-heels]

Tories in a Tory area voting for a tax increase? Can't see it myself.

Its Tories vs Tories. Its great.

[Lush is the best medicine...]

Liverpool took a 5.9% cut to spending power for 2015/16. Surrey came out with more money than they had before by 3.1%.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30537288

Not going to bet against emergency funding arriving miraculously in 'hard hit' Tory councils again. (Not denying they've made cuts and 'savings' too, just ridiculous the coverage Surrey are getting while the North is getting absolutely hammered.)

we should vote a few of them in up here then

[Zeb]

Just a quick recap of how ESA works. You get interviewed by an independent doctor/nurse/health worker of some sort. They advise the Job Centre on how ill you are. If you're too ill to work at all then you're placed into what is called the ESA Support Group.

However, lots of people with mental illnesses are too sick to work. So the government is now proposing, by making the interview only determine how much in benefits the sick person gets, that there be some sort of sanctions for them because that will cure their illnesses  increase how quickly they become well  save lots of money (it doesn't - it just moves the problem elsewhere)  be a thoroughly Tory thing to do.

Mind has a short-form response document to provide your feedback to this latest idea. https://action.mind.org.uk/your-message-government

I forgot to include sufficiently blue language about how outrageous this suggestion is.

[Zeb]

While I'm thinking of shitehawkery. Mark Brown had a good article in the Guardian today on the impact of austerity upon social care for those who have a disability. Joined up government it is not and thoroughly grim as the whole system teeters on the brink after so many cuts.

The inescapable logic of austerity is looking likely, once again, to reduce people with disabilities to objects – and in doing so to reduce their independence, options and enjoyment of life. According to the Health Service Journal, Freedom of Information (FOI) requests from campaign group Disability United found that 37 NHS clinical commissioning groups (CCGs) in England were introducing rules about ongoing care that could force up to 13,000 people with health conditions into care homes. The CCGs will essentially begin saying to people with disabilities and long-term health needs: if you haven’t got the cash for homecare, then it’s off to a care home for you.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/25/disabled-people-disabilities-health-care-homes

[Redman0151]

May talking about standing shoulder to shoulder with Trump



Fuck the Torys and fuck Trump

[Dr. Beaker]

No clown kecks today, she seems to have gone for the lesbian look. Think she would have been safe anyway.

[TravisBickle]

Theresa May is an apologist for fascism. I don't use such language sparingly but she has made her position perfectly clear over the last 24 hours. "Germany's policy on Jews is Germany's business." Fuck her and every other right wing gimp who fails to call out Trump for the racist, knuckle dragging c*nt that he is.

[fudge]

Oh there's a special rung in Hell reserved for those bastards, really close in to the mummified but still moist sphincter of Cameron that they will all be condemned to lick repeatedly while incanting "We've got the power to make a difference!".

Therein lies the problem. I voted lib dem and can't abide the Tories. Hence my decision not to vote for them after what I perceived as Cleggs betrayal to go into coalition.

But your sentiment there is the People's Front of Judea problem the left has hamstrung been for as long as I can remember, and is currently destroying Labour at the moment.

Let's not forget your own party was just as culpable in not wanting to do any sort of coalition. Quite happy to allow the conservatives to deal with the clusterfuck of an economy at the time.

Equally you had the opportunity to vote for PR but chose that cynically as a way to 'punish' the Lib Dems in quite possibly the most ridiculous example of cutting ones nose off ever. Now with boundary changes and you having completely lost any power in Scotland means you've abdicated power to the right for years to come.

I voted Labour last because I thought it was the only way to stop the tories, and I like Corbyn on a large number of issues but I'm likely to vote Lib Dem again because they're the only party with the balls to be pro Europe. Corbyns obvious disdain for the EU affecting adversely the Brexit campaign.

If you can't work with left leaning people like us then you deserve to be out of power

[The Gulleysucker]

In the context of what led up to that post, I stand by what I said.

.....Fuck the Tory's and anybody who voted them

   

   Fuck anyone who didn't vote Labour and thus contributed to letting the bastards in    again.
   

Including Lib dems?

We had a discussion back in May 2010, just post election, when you were enthusiastic for Clegg.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=9dde7502bb00e1b4676c27d7b5cd983b&topic=255018.msg6921924#msg6921924

I said...

I respect your opinion Fudge but Clegg has really sold your lot down the river with this.

As the BBC have just pointed out, there won't be anymore 3 way discussion on things like Newsnight, only 2 way between Labour and the Government. Even PM's questions are going to be affected. Your lot have become and will be portrayed as Tories no matter how it's spun and I think your hopes for an even better show of MPs under the promised AV, and don't forget that's just for a referendum not an implementation, will be shattered if not totally evaporate when the realisation of what's just happened sinks in with not only a large proportion of Liberal supporters but for everyone who voted for Liberal at the election in the hope of unseating a Tory.

I honestly believe that Clegg should have walked away from the Tories as well and let them run a minority Government on their terms and for the Liberals to achieve ad-hoc arrangements with both parties to swing appropriate Liberal friendly legislation and policies.

Well that's not going to happen now. Clegg is Camerons poodle and I fear all for ego and a ministerial salary and pension and elevation to the Lords when it all ends.


Other than Clegg not yet being elevated to the Lords, what did I get wrong?

....If you can't work with left leaning people like us then you deserve to be out of power

Ever thought of doing a standup routine?

It was the Liberals under Clegg who didn't want to work with left leaning people in Labour and instead decided to work with the Tories.

http://www.newstatesman.com/2010/12/labour-lib-andrew-coalition

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=BOqtAwAAQBAJ&pg=PT177&lpg=PT177&dq=clegg+rules+out+coalition+with+labour&source=bl&ots=xyUvhfRCM_&sig=g-Ojj2yqMpXvhY_STP6YwF20W5k&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwip3YurlufRAhWhBcAKHYnfC2M4KBDoAQhTMAk#v=onepage&q=clegg%20rules%20out%20coalition%20with%20labour&f=false