Author Topic: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory  (Read 9533 times)

Offline longball

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #40 on: January 17, 2013, 02:29:58 am »
I am opposed to the disgusting practices which are involved in producing shark fin soup and foie gras. As you say, there is a big gap between that and the humane farming of cows, pigs, chickens etc as food sources.

Humane? Have you seen how the vast vast majority of chicken and pigs are farmed? Anything but humane. We're a horrible horrible species.

Offline wampa1

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #41 on: January 17, 2013, 12:50:18 pm »
Unfortunately, it's a societal acceptance that the suffering endured by cows and chickens gets a bye into the next round.

Foie gras, shark fin soup etc should quite rightly be knocked out as soon as possible.  It's disgusting and I really oppose the... decadence of it all. 

On a personal level, I'm eating way less meat than I used to.  Sausages are gone, mince beef is gone, lamb went ages ago, and chicken is on its way out now too.  I can't imagine I'll eliminate it totally but I'm cutting down significantly.

Offline alfonso

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #42 on: January 20, 2013, 02:20:01 am »
Someone justifying shark fin soup earlier - so, you support the extinction of sharks? 60 years they will be gone. The whole eco system of the ocean will change.
They don't breed like fish. Will they start targeting dolphins next (we know the Japanese slaughtered a load last month, trapped in a bay)?
Tuna has 60 years if they are lucky. Blue fin tuna maybe 5 years til extinction. Sea horses are heading towards the same future. As tiger numbers are falling and they face extinction in the wild, poachers are targeting lions (which makes the Chinese medicine requirement ridiculous in itself as they aren't using tigers now).

Most humans can not live with out animals. All animals if (left alone) can live without humans.
Whether it is slaughtering them for their meat, using their skin or fur, culling them for their teeth or claws for quack medicine, laughing at them at circuses, or staring at them in an animal jail we call zoos, billions of them each year get a shit deal off the so called most intelligent animal of the lot.
If you were the devil's advocate looking at it from above, you would say we are uncivilised.
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Offline JackBauer

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #43 on: January 21, 2013, 04:33:58 pm »
Humane? Have you seen how the vast vast majority of chicken and pigs are farmed? Anything but humane. We're a horrible horrible species.

I used the word "humane" to differentiate between battery farming (which I agree is horrible) and allowing said pigs/cows/chickens etc to run around outside, feeding them proper food, giving them bedtime cuddles, etc.
DAMMIT!

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #44 on: February 7, 2013, 08:28:24 am »
Poaching boom sees thousands of elephants killed in Gabon



Elephant poaching across Africa is said to be at its highest level in 20 years

More than 11,000 elephants have been killed by ivory poachers in Gabon since 2004 according to new research.

The country is home to over half of Africa's forest elephants who are highly valued because of the quality of their tusks.

Campaigners say the situation in what was believed to be a safe haven for these elephants is "out of control."

They blame the ongoing high demand for jewellery and other ivory products in Asia.

Gabon holds about 13% of the forests of Central Africa but it is home to around 40,000 forest elephants, a smaller species that are attractive to poachers because their ivory is tinged with pink and is very hard.

The new research has been carried out by the Gabonese national parks agency (ANPN) alongside WWF and the Wildlife Conservation Society (WCS).

Cross border poachers
Dr Fiona Maisels of the WCS explained that they had analysed the population of elephants in the Minkebe national park and compared it with their data gathered in the same area 9 years ago.

"Between 44-77% of the elephants have been killed," she said. "In other words 11,100 elephants have been lost since 2004."

Much of the attention on elephant poaching has been in the neighbouring Democratic Republic of Congo but with demand for ivory growing and prices rocketing in recent years, poachers have sought out the forest elephants in the vast expanses of Minkebe.

And despite the efforts of the Gabonese government to bolster anti-poaching patrols, according to Bas Huijbregts from WWF, the authorities are failing.

"In an area like Minkebe which is about 30,000 sq km, that's about the size of Belgium, without any roads. It is very difficult to track poachers here," he said.

The authorities believe that between 50 and 100 elephants per day were being killed in the park in 2011. Much of the poaching has been carried out by gangs from neighbouring Cameroon, with ivory carried across the northern border by porters.

The high prices being paid for ivory in Asian markets are having a knock-on effect on attempts to control the trade in Gabon says Bas Huijbregts.

"Such a high value commodity, it is corrupting governance on all levels - there are checkpoints all over the place, but no one ever detects that ivory," he said.

"When arrests are made, they are often obstructed by government people who have a stake in the trade as well."

In June last year Gabon's president Ali Bongo Ondimba ordered the burning of the country's stockpile of seized ivory. However the poaching continues and is leading many conservationists to question the long term survival of elephants in Africa.

Professor Lee White who heads Gabon's national park system said that despite their best efforts, the situation is running out of control.

"If we do not turn the situation around quickly, the future of the elephant in Africa is doomed," he said. "These new results illustrate starkly just how dramatic the situation has become."

Campaigners say that next month's meeting of the convention on the international trade in endangered species (CITES) will be an opportunity for global governments to strengthen measures against ivory poaching.

In the UK, WWF are seeking a million signatures on a petition to stamp out legal loopholes that allow the ivory trade to continue.

Offline mccred

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #45 on: February 7, 2013, 10:28:15 am »
The cruelty involved in making foie gras is revolting. It's why making it is banned in a lot of places.  The French government claims it's part of their gastronomical heritage. I think that makes them at best disgracefully indifferent to animal suffering and sadistic c*nts at worst.

As far as shark fin soup goes, I am utterly indifferent to whether it tastes bland, great or foul. I can't see how anyone can in good conscience eat something that is a product of such utter barbarity. It's horrific.

Have to agree with you. Saw a program where they caught a shark, hauled it aboard, cut off it fins and then through it back?
Now I enjoy meat as much as anyone but at least the cow that I've eaten part of, should of been humanly treated through out its life, then humanly killed. Then apart from the shit in its stomach, which may get used, ( fertilizer? ) every other part of the animal is used, its meat, skin, even hoofs for making glue.
Humans are cruel, nature is indifferent. There's a big difference.
Think the biggest problem though is that the end user always seems to be China and we have no leverage over them to change their traditions.
Don't believe in the death penalty, so I think poachers killing elephants, tigers etc should get life with no possible chance of parole.
The death penalty in America doesn't seem to stop them shooting each other, so I can't see it stopping poor African's who are trying to feed their family's. Difficult one to find a solution for.
Can wild elephants be de-tusked so there is nothing for a poacher to take? Or is that cruel in itself?
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Offline RojoLeón

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #46 on: February 8, 2013, 12:44:30 am »
Spoiler
[close]

I was pretty shocked when I saw it too. Now I know that when I see an ivory ornament or art-work, that the elephant possibly (most efficient way of ensuring intact tusks, I suppose) had their head sawn in half. Kind of puts the decorative beauty of ivory in perspective.

Six tonnes of cruelty and waste, just so some people can make a few bucks.
« Last Edit: February 8, 2013, 04:04:17 am by RojoLeón »

Offline Pendzo

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #47 on: February 8, 2013, 02:04:43 am »
That's a very shocking and sad picture  :-\

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #48 on: February 8, 2013, 02:47:30 am »
Fuck.

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #49 on: February 8, 2013, 02:50:27 am »
Can you spoiler that please? Might just be me, but I find that kind of thing very distressing. And it makes me fucking rage.
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Offline Gifted Right Foot

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #50 on: February 8, 2013, 02:54:07 am »
sickening

Offline LFCDad

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #51 on: February 8, 2013, 09:28:21 am »
something close to my heart this, when I read about those elephants i was physically sick, lived a lot of my life in Kenya since deciding to leave the UK around 15 years ago. There's so much corruption amongst the wildlife officials that means poaching still occurs and is on the rise. bastards
Being logical is apparently not allowed, if people don't read your posts properly, it's your fault for posting. Gotta love the socialism espoused by so called socialists who act like Fascists for their little best friends on the site

Offline eirwen

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #52 on: February 8, 2013, 11:00:52 am »
 :'(

Offline Cocomin

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #53 on: February 8, 2013, 11:17:24 am »
What can we do about this ?
I can honestly see a point before the middles of this century where there are no Elephants left in the wild it's that serious.
The Chinese government are to blame for this in my opinion they know it's going on why do they not ban these products that
are made from Ivory and the trading will soon stop if there is no market.
We need a big hitter like Obama for example to have talks with them about this every other country is scared because they
don't want to upset the Chinese because they are the new economic powerhouse.
I work in Africa myself working in the oil business and have countless stories of Chinese oil workers taking home Ivory , there are
hundreds if not thousands of makeshift runways beside new oil refineries and it's just to easy to bribe the African officials.

I started working down in West Africa in 2003 and you hardly saw any Chinese but now they are everywhere they have given every president form Nigeria,Congo,Gabon,Cameroon,Angola etc Billions in a promise that they can get first dibs on their oil and minerals and that is why you now see a massive increase in poaching.

It's not only Elephants though Rhino and even Lions are getting poached to extremes it's very very serious only the Chinese
can put a stop to it and that doesn't look very likely at all.

Offline JohnHobbes

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #54 on: February 8, 2013, 12:32:33 pm »
Absolute appalling. Sickens me to see such beautiful animals killed because some imbecile thinks the ivory is pretty. Or they want to use it as a 'medicine' similarly to how tigers are killed on a huge scale. There aren't cultural excuses for this, it's unacceptable and thankfully there seems to be a growing consensus on that from the Chinese themselves (certainly the middle class from what I understand). Only way this will stop is if the target market doesn't exist any more and it's not profitable for people to do it.

Offline marko35s

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #55 on: February 28, 2013, 11:11:14 pm »
What can we do about this ?
I can honestly see a point before the middles of this century where there are no Elephants left in the wild it's that serious.
The Chinese government are to blame for this in my opinion they know it's going on why do they not ban these products that
are made from Ivory and the trading will soon stop if there is no market.
We need a big hitter like Obama for example to have talks with them about this every other country is scared because they
don't want to upset the Chinese because they are the new economic powerhouse.
I work in Africa myself working in the oil business and have countless stories of Chinese oil workers taking home Ivory , there are
hundreds if not thousands of makeshift runways beside new oil refineries and it's just to easy to bribe the African officials.

I started working down in West Africa in 2003 and you hardly saw any Chinese but now they are everywhere they have given every president form Nigeria,Congo,Gabon,Cameroon,Angola etc Billions in a promise that they can get first dibs on their oil and minerals and that is why you now see a massive increase in poaching.

It's not only Elephants though Rhino and even Lions are getting poached to extremes it's very very serious only the Chinese
can put a stop to it and that doesn't look very likely at all.

Rhino will be the first to go, they are seriously close already.
And yes the Chinese are everywhere now and not just on large projects. Many shops in small towns are now Chinese owned and often staffed pretty much by Chinese (family maybe?), this has the knock on effect of adding to unemployment, poverty and all the wonderful things that go hand in hand with that.

Offline Trada

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #56 on: December 31, 2016, 05:40:26 am »
Some good news for a change when it comes to Ivory.

China Just Announced It Will Ban All Ivory Trade By The End Of 2017

Next year might technically be the year of the rooster on the Chinese zodiac. But we prefer to think of it as the year of the elephant.

In a huge move, China has just announced that it will ban all processing and trade of ivory by the end of 2017, with the first factories scheduled to shut down in just three months time, by the end of March.
 

"China will gradually stop the processing and sales of ivories for commercial purposes by the end of 2017," said the official Xinhua news agency, citing a government statement.

The move has been heralded as a 'game changer' by environmental organisations such as the World Wildlife Fund and Natural Resources Defence Council, seeing as China is one of the biggest global markets for ivory, where it’s used as a precious material in jewellery, furniture, and sometimes even Chinese medicine.

"This is great news that will shut down the world’s largest market for elephant ivory," Aili Kang, executive director of the Wildlife Conservation Society in Asia, said in a statement.

With fewer than half a million African elephants remaining, the question is whether this be enough to save this vulnerable species from a steady decline into extinction.

More than 20,000 elephants are killed for their tusks each year, according to the World Wildlife Fund for Nature, with much of it destined for ivory-hungry markets in China, Hong Kong, and the United States. Some African countries have even seen a 60 percent decline in elephant numbers between 2009 and 2014.

Since 1989, there’s been an international treaty in place outlawing the sale of ivory harvested after 1975, known as the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES) But without local legislation to back this up, the treaty often goes ignored.
 

Last year, China committed itself to slowly strangling domestic trade in ivory products. "We will strictly control ivory processing and trade until the commercial processing and sale of ivory and its products are eventually halted," announced the head of China’s State Forestry Administration, Zhao Shucong in May last year.

This was just one part of a 10-point plan intended to eradicate the sale and distribution of ivory across the country, which included education campaigns and increased online surveillance. And there are signs that the demand for ivory domestically has already been dropping.

In March 2016 that control was extended to halt the import of ivory and ivory products acquired before 1975, which goes beyond the initial CITES agreement.

But now China will ban all domestic ivory trade and processing by the end of 2017, with the first several dozen factories and outlets to hand in their licenses and close by the end of March.

If you’re in China and want to offload your grandmother’s heirloom ivory teeth after that, you’ll need to be granted special authorisation. China will also retain a stockpile of ivory it bought before CITES introduced the ivory ban, which it can sell.

Given the growing Chinese middle class has a penchant for trinkets carved from elephant tusks, it’s hoped this national ban will give the international treaty some teeth. In nations such as Australia, there is no local law preventing domestic trade.

An investigation into the sale of ivory and rhino horn in Australia and New Zealand earlier this year found only ten percent of items being sold carried the right documentation.

With China’s progressive step, all eyes are now turning to Hong Kong which is permitted to run under its own laws. The World Wildlife Fund is calling on the Chinese territory to follow suit, and end its own ivory trade by 2021.

"With China’s market closed, Hong Kong can become a preferred market for traffickers to launder illegal ivory under cover of the legal ivory trade," senior wildlife crime officer Cheryl Lo told The Guardian.

Stamping out domestic trade is a significant step, if not the sole solution to wiping out the poaching of elephants. With around their population sinking from several million to 415,000 in under a century, time is ticking for the beloved animals.

http://thelightmedia.com/posts/35649-china-just-announced-it-will-ban-all-ivory-trade-by-the-end-of-2017
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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #57 on: December 31, 2016, 10:47:58 am »
I've always wondered, would it be possible to grow Ivory in a lab now? Advances in genetics means it cannot be far off, flood the market with farmed ivory to make it uneconomical to poach and sell ivory from elephants.

Obviously the real way to stop it would be if there was no demand from fake medicine.

Offline Red-Soldier

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #58 on: December 31, 2016, 10:57:10 am »


It sounds good, but it's just a lot of hot air I'm afraid.

They have been turning a blind eye to wildlife crime for years.

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #59 on: December 31, 2016, 12:00:21 pm »
There could be something like 10 million mammoths buried in Siberia.  I've often wondered whether it'd be profitable to start mining mammoths... 


Edit:   http://www.mammothmining.com
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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #60 on: December 31, 2016, 01:06:36 pm »
I'm quite positive about this. There're a couple of quotes from people who would know more about the true picture behind the scenes.

Quote
WWF-China chief executive Lo Sze Ping added: “Closing the world’s largest legal ivory market will deter people in China and beyond from buying ivory, and make it harder for ivory traffickers to sell their illegal stocks.”
Quote
WWF-UK wildlife charity acting chief executive Glyn Davies, who says an elephant is poached every 15 minutes, told The Times: “China has shown good leadership and we are now looking to other markets to close legal trade and implement stricter enforcement measures.”

The last Conservative Party manifesto promised to outlaw all ivory trading, but Environment Secretary Andrea Leadsom’s recent ban allowed for sales of pre-1947 antiques.

Charlie Mayhew, chief executive of African wildlife charity Tusk, which has Prince William as patron, said: “It emphasises the need for the UK to move swiftly and follow suit.”

http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/china-ivory-trade-ban-2017-game-changer-africa-elephant-wwf-a7503121.html

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #61 on: December 31, 2016, 11:44:50 pm »
Lots of positive news coming out from China recently.

Hope they keep up the good work  :)
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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #62 on: January 1, 2017, 08:17:46 pm »
I'm quite positive about this. There're a couple of quotes from people who would know more about the true picture behind the scenes.

http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/china-ivory-trade-ban-2017-game-changer-africa-elephant-wwf-a7503121.html

Like I said, it sounds good, but as always, the proof is in the pudding.

China has a very poor history in this regard

Have a read:

China accused of defying its own ban on breeding tigers to profit from body parts

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/sep/27/china-accused-of-defying-its-own-ban-on-breeding-tigers-to-profit-from-body-parts

China has been accused of deceiving the international community by allowing a network of farms to breed thousands of captive tigers for the sale of their body parts, in breach of their own longstanding ban on the trade.

The Chinese government has allowed about 200 specialist farms to hold an estimated 6,000 tigers for slaughter, before their skins are sold as decoration and their bones are marinated to produce tonics and lotions. Campaigners say this has increased demand for the products and provoked the poaching of thousands of wild tigers, whose global population is now down to just 3,500.




Offline Trada

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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #63 on: January 2, 2017, 04:59:22 am »
Now they need to stop cutting off shark fins.

They say millions are killed every year and 4 years ago they said they would ban shark fin soup.

But a good sign they are starting to change for the good.
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Re: Horror as entire family of elephants slaughtered for ivory
« Reply #64 on: January 2, 2017, 09:19:58 am »
Now they need to stop cutting off shark fins.

They say millions are killed every year and 4 years ago they said they would ban shark fin soup.

But a good sign they are starting to change for the good.

They aren't though, that's the point I've been making.

Bans don't mean a thing if they continue to turn a blind eye, which they have been doing for years.

I work in conservation and would say that I know a fair amount in regards to wildlife crime.