Author Topic: Arsenal  (Read 5732254 times)

Offline Studgotelli

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40800 on: December 19, 2016, 10:49:44 am »
Suddenly looking over their shoulders for 4th. Only last week they hadn't lost since August. Crazy but still thinking there's a lot of overreaction.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40801 on: December 19, 2016, 11:02:19 am »
Fair play to North Bank for coming back from his timeshare with Cantona early.
If he's being asked to head the ball too frequently - which isn't exactly his specialty - it could affect his ear and cause an infection. Especially if the ball hits him on the ear directly.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40802 on: December 19, 2016, 11:17:49 am »
When you think of Arsenal in their prime, they always had men (some hard-knocks too) in their squad.

Viera, Bergkamp, Pires, Adams, Keown, Toure, Silva, Parlour, Campbell, even Henry to some extent.

They have a lot of talent in their team, no doubt about that, but they're very young and immature. Apart from Cech, Koscielny and Sanchez I'm struggling to think of anyone with any presence about them. Maybe Mustafi?

It's never been Wenger's policy but he could do with getting in a couple of wise old heads.

Their side isn't young anymore - that would be Spurs and ourselves. It's a complete misconception based on the past.

Offline Solomon Grundy

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40803 on: December 19, 2016, 11:24:13 am »
Claude and TY are absolute gold :lmao

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/bnJOPZPQ9j8" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/bnJOPZPQ9j8</a>

 Feel sorry for Claude. But he really is going to have to calm down. Can't be good for his health that.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2016, 01:39:46 pm by The 'd'Esk »

Offline Chris~

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40804 on: December 19, 2016, 11:26:45 am »
Their side isn't young anymore - that would be Spurs and ourselves. It's a complete misconception based on the past.
Had a quick look and hadn't realised how old their attack is, Iwobi (20) Chamberlain (23) and Welbeck (26) are the only ones under 27. Even if they sign Sanchez and Ozil to long contract they need some serious investment in some younger players there over the next few seasons.

Offline The North Bank

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40805 on: December 19, 2016, 11:39:10 am »
Fair play to North Bank for coming back from his timeshare with Cantona early.

I thought this was the darts thread. Can we discuss important things like Michael Van Gerwin.

I do also think that Claude needs to calm down. He went missing not long ago and caused a scare, he's obviously very invested emotionally with Arsenal, but doesn't seem to have much else going on so he takes things so personally that it could be dangerously unhealthy.


Offline DivisiveNewSigning

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40806 on: December 19, 2016, 11:51:31 am »
Their side isn't young anymore - that would be Spurs and ourselves. It's a complete misconception based on the past.

The average age of their squad is about 1.5 years older than ours. I guess it is a slight misconception.

We have our own mentality issues from time to time but Arsenal have been bottlers for a long time too. Seeing Xhaka, Coquelin and Ozil walking around the pitch yesterday must have been infuriating. Something you can never fault our lot is a lack of effort.

Offline the good half

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40807 on: December 19, 2016, 11:59:48 am »
It's still bloody December.
There will be ups and downs all the way here.
It's Chelsea's run thats causing the bottleneck scenario between 6 and 2.
But evceryone will have a spell in those positions between now and when it matters; including United.
Arsenal always dip but they do but big runs togetehr.
So it all makes it interesting.
People losing theirs minds like this Arsenal fan? crazy.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40808 on: December 19, 2016, 12:14:28 pm »
When November goes right, means our December will suck ;)

First half was fine, Man City had set up badly and we exploited that to an extent, was a bit hectic but we defended well, got the ball but lacked a bit of belief in final third. Man City changed things at half time and we couldn't cope, when we got the ball we looked clumsy and slow, we could not escape the high press and when Man City had the ball, our midfield provided no shield and our defence seemed to never get into a position to intervene, it looked all a bit too easy for City. They used their bench better and we never rallied. Wenger has mentioned team being tired, leaves questions about why we seem more tired then everyone else going into this week.

Monreal is patently not good enough for Arsenal if they want to win the league. Lets them down too often. It's a shame for them because imo Cech, Bellerin and Koscielny definitely are (Mustafi yet to be seen).

Been a good servant but his form has really gone downhill this season

I wonder how much of this poor form is down to Mustafi's absence. It's amazing how much difference a good defender can make to how an entire team plays. Not just through lack of individual errors, but by allowing the entire team to play further up the pitch and giving the midfield more confidence to attack.

I don't think it's a coincidence that they've lost the two (very winnable) games that he's missed.

We didn't play well against Man U with him in team and we hadn't keep a cleansheet for some time with him in the side. We are leaking too many goals to win the league, it was going to catch up with us at some point

Was corzola a big miss. Does he bring that 'spine'.when is he back?

He is a player with bite and might have got us out of the high press, has never looked clumsy. Needs a runner alongside him though

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40809 on: December 19, 2016, 12:20:12 pm »
Had a quick look and hadn't realised how old their attack is, Iwobi (20) Chamberlain (23) and Welbeck (26) are the only ones under 27. Even if they sign Sanchez and Ozil to long contract they need some serious investment in some younger players there over the next few seasons.
http://www.worldfootball.net/teams/arsenal-fc/2017/2/
They've 11 forwards in their squad according to that link, and only 3 are over 27, so not sure where you're getting those figures from. Plus, Sanchez only turns 28 today. Perez was 28 in September, and only Giroud is over 28. That's not what I'd call an aging set of forwards.
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Offline gazzalfc

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40810 on: December 19, 2016, 12:39:42 pm »
Feel sorry for Caude. But he really is going to have to calm down. Can't be good for his health that.

Didn't he go missing over the Summer and had some form of breakdown? Like full on police searches, missing persons report etc?

Offline Chris~

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40811 on: December 19, 2016, 12:58:38 pm »
http://www.worldfootball.net/teams/arsenal-fc/2017/2/
They've 11 forwards in their squad according to that link, and only 3 are over 27, so not sure where you're getting those figures from. Plus, Sanchez only turns 28 today. Perez was 28 in September, and only Giroud is over 28. That's not what I'd call an aging set of forwards.
I was talking about first team squad. Don't think any arsenal fan includes sanogoo or akpom. Same way i wouldnt include woodburn with us yet. That's is old when all three of your striker are 28+ except one with another serious injury.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40812 on: December 19, 2016, 01:01:29 pm »
Claude is exactly how I picture half the reactionary twatty posters we get in post match threads after we have a bad result  ;D

Offline Gerry Attrick

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40813 on: December 19, 2016, 01:06:17 pm »
Claude is exactly how I picture half the reactionary twatty posters we get in post match threads after we have a bad result  ;D

Can understand his frustration to be honest, he's been watching Arsenal make the same mistakes for years.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40814 on: December 19, 2016, 01:18:32 pm »
Except today Arsenal were never on top -- apart from scoring early, they were totally dominated and outclassed by Man City.
They really weren't. If Arsenal had continued playing as they did in the first half they would've won 2 or 3-0.
Then in the midddle out pops a smiling glen johnson pulling up his jersey to reveal a t-shirt of suarez with a text saying. "OUR SUAREZ IS A FRIEND TO ALL COLOURS!"

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40815 on: December 19, 2016, 01:26:20 pm »
I was talking about first team squad. Don't think any arsenal fan includes sanogoo or akpom. Same way i wouldnt include woodburn with us yet. That's is old when all three of your striker are 28+ except one with another serious injury.

1 of them has only been 28 for 13 and a half hours. He hasn't became a geriatric overnight you know.
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40816 on: December 19, 2016, 01:38:34 pm »
Claude is exactly how I picture half the reactionary twatty posters we get in post match threads after we have a bad result  ;D
To be fair, there is a video of him saying Arsenal is pretty much his only escape, seems he has a lot of problems with his life. If Arsenal is his only escape, I feel sorry for the dude.
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40817 on: December 19, 2016, 01:39:19 pm »
Didn't he go missing over the Summer and had some form of breakdown? Like full on police searches, missing persons report etc?
Yes
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40818 on: December 19, 2016, 01:40:07 pm »
Didn't he go missing over the Summer and had some form of breakdown? Like full on police searches, missing persons report etc?

Dunno mate.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40819 on: December 19, 2016, 02:39:06 pm »
Sorry that was the funniest rant video I've seen - maybe ever.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40820 on: December 19, 2016, 02:50:35 pm »
I was talking about first team squad. Don't think any arsenal fan includes sanogoo or akpom. Same way i wouldnt include woodburn with us yet. That's is old when all three of your striker are 28+ except one with another serious injury.

The ages of the forwards aren't much of an issue for me now. In fact Wenger has bought slightly older & more experienced the last couple of years in the hope he gets more maturity from the performances. All it takes is to sign 1 or 2 more forwards players under 26 and we are back to dropping the average age a bit. I think we've a good balance in the squad of younger guys  & older more experience guys so there's no excuse there why we aren't performing (before we might have been accused of being a bit too young & naive). It's more the quality I'm worried about.

Offline ThePeetmix

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40821 on: December 19, 2016, 02:50:50 pm »
He is of age where he got to see a spell of brilliant Arsenal sides who were both supremely skillful and tough as nails. Now watching 10 years of an Arsenal side become still very skillful but so powderpuff. I don't think younger fans understand why the older fans are at the end of their tether.

Arsenal fan tv is like a cartoon show about Arsenal fans.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40822 on: December 19, 2016, 03:10:03 pm »
I'm not sure Wenger deserves sacking, but I think Arsenal could benefit from change after this season. In saying that I'm not sure who they could go for after. My mate said the Leipzig coach was being looked at. Simeone wants to go to Inter next. Not that many options.
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40823 on: December 19, 2016, 03:11:59 pm »
I'll try and make a point via an analogy regarding Arsene Wenger (and Mourinho) that I hope makes sense (I know what I mean anyway)

In any walk of life, how long does your true 'genius' level output last? if you look at any musician, sportsman etc etc, the period at which that person truly excels is fairly short lived. That is not to say that the person concerned cannot continue at a high level for a period of time but that the point at which they were a ground breaker can never be regained. That can be for any number of reasons, money, age, kids/no kids/ marital situation, illness, family illness etc.

Take someone like Noel Gallagher, now whether you like Oasis or not, it cannot be argued that for a period of 3 or 4 years in the mid 90s, they were absolutely massive. Now, the point is, i'm sure he would like to go back and get that success again but the point is you can't just turn up at a studio and recreate something that you did 20 years ago just because you want to. You were a different person then, your priorities were different, your time is taken up in different ways, your energy is used in different ways, the people around you are different and life changes. You can still make good records, you will still sell records but you will never be at the cutting edge of music because you had your time and it has gone.

My point is that for people like Wenger and Mourinho, they have shone very brightly as managers but their time as real shining light, cutting edge managers has gone and others have taken their place. They can still do the jobs they are asked to do to a high level but the hunger is not what it was, the energy is not the same, the desire to fight the world and prove you are the best has dimmed and it will not return. Wenger will continue to do a solid, professional job for as long as he remains at Arsenal but for any fan expecting him to roll back the years and set the standard for everyone else to follow, those days are gone and they aren't coming back.
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40824 on: December 19, 2016, 03:13:42 pm »
They could use Simeone

Offline Nessy76

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40825 on: December 19, 2016, 03:15:19 pm »
"Dont swear at me x1000"

What a bellend. Also screaming "Don't question my fanbase!" What does that even mean? hahahahaha

And all this from a fully grown man kitted out had to toe in the club shop including a pair of Arsenal fucking headphones. Comedy gold.

He's dug a hole for himself there. Once it's clear that the guy is going to continue to swear, he has to either move on or bring some consequences, which was clearly never going to happen.
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40826 on: December 19, 2016, 03:17:09 pm »
I'm not sure Wenger deserves sacking, but I think Arsenal could benefit from change after this season. In saying that I'm not sure who they could go for after. My mate said the Leipzig coach was being looked at. Simeone wants to go to Inter next. Not that many options.

They'll probably be competing with Man United as well. Mourinho won't get two years if he misses out on top four.
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40827 on: December 19, 2016, 04:22:54 pm »
The ages of the forwards aren't much of an issue for me now. In fact Wenger has bought slightly older & more experienced the last couple of years in the hope he gets more maturity from the performances. All it takes is to sign 1 or 2 more forwards players under 26 and we are back to dropping the average age a bit. I think we've a good balance in the squad of younger guys  & older more experience guys so there's no excuse there why we aren't performing (before we might have been accused of being a bit too young & naive). It's more the quality I'm worried about.
Pretty sure City fans thought it was that easy as well

Offline ScottishGoon

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40828 on: December 19, 2016, 05:35:39 pm »
Pretty sure City fans thought it was that easy as well

To be fair, it's not quite the same thing, City had an ageing squad, defenders, full backs, midfielders & forwards. Arsenal have guys like Bellerin, Mustafi, Holding, Xhaka, Wilshere, Ramsey, Coquelin, Ox Chamberlain, Iwobi all under 27. Might not all be top quality, but certainly enough to make the basis of a good squad still.

Offline CallumLFC

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40829 on: December 19, 2016, 05:47:37 pm »
I'll try and make a point via an analogy regarding Arsene Wenger (and Mourinho) that I hope makes sense (I know what I mean anyway)

In any walk of life, how long does your true 'genius' level output last? if you look at any musician, sportsman etc etc, the period at which that person truly excels is fairly short lived. That is not to say that the person concerned cannot continue at a high level for a period of time but that the point at which they were a ground breaker can never be regained. That can be for any number of reasons, money, age, kids/no kids/ marital situation, illness, family illness etc.

Take someone like Noel Gallagher, now whether you like Oasis or not, it cannot be argued that for a period of 3 or 4 years in the mid 90s, they were absolutely massive. Now, the point is, i'm sure he would like to go back and get that success again but the point is you can't just turn up at a studio and recreate something that you did 20 years ago just because you want to. You were a different person then, your priorities were different, your time is taken up in different ways, your energy is used in different ways, the people around you are different and life changes. You can still make good records, you will still sell records but you will never be at the cutting edge of music because you had your time and it has gone.

My point is that for people like Wenger and Mourinho, they have shone very brightly as managers but their time as real shining light, cutting edge managers has gone and others have taken their place. They can still do the jobs they are asked to do to a high level but the hunger is not what it was, the energy is not the same, the desire to fight the world and prove you are the best has dimmed and it will not return. Wenger will continue to do a solid, professional job for as long as he remains at Arsenal but for any fan expecting him to roll back the years and set the standard for everyone else to follow, those days are gone and they aren't coming back.

Very true.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40830 on: December 19, 2016, 05:58:25 pm »
I'll try and make a point via an analogy regarding Arsene Wenger (and Mourinho) that I hope makes sense (I know what I mean anyway)

In any walk of life, how long does your true 'genius' level output last? if you look at any musician, sportsman etc etc, the period at which that person truly excels is fairly short lived. That is not to say that the person concerned cannot continue at a high level for a period of time but that the point at which they were a ground breaker can never be regained. That can be for any number of reasons, money, age, kids/no kids/ marital situation, illness, family illness etc.

Take someone like Noel Gallagher, now whether you like Oasis or not, it cannot be argued that for a period of 3 or 4 years in the mid 90s, they were absolutely massive. Now, the point is, i'm sure he would like to go back and get that success again but the point is you can't just turn up at a studio and recreate something that you did 20 years ago just because you want to. You were a different person then, your priorities were different, your time is taken up in different ways, your energy is used in different ways, the people around you are different and life changes. You can still make good records, you will still sell records but you will never be at the cutting edge of music because you had your time and it has gone.

My point is that for people like Wenger and Mourinho, they have shone very brightly as managers but their time as real shining light, cutting edge managers has gone and others have taken their place. They can still do the jobs they are asked to do to a high level but the hunger is not what it was, the energy is not the same, the desire to fight the world and prove you are the best has dimmed and it will not return. Wenger will continue to do a solid, professional job for as long as he remains at Arsenal but for any fan expecting him to roll back the years and set the standard for everyone else to follow, those days are gone and they aren't coming back.
So, Klopp is Noel Gallagher. Got it.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40831 on: December 19, 2016, 07:01:34 pm »
So, Klopp is Noel Gallagher. Got it.

Nah. Klopp's more like David Bowie, constantly reinventing himself to stay relevant.
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40832 on: December 19, 2016, 07:02:11 pm »
Nah. Klopp's more like David Bowie, constantly reinventing himself to stay relevant.

Well... not anymore.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40833 on: December 19, 2016, 07:06:37 pm »
That last season at Dortmund better turn out to be Pin Ups rather than Tin Machine II.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40834 on: December 19, 2016, 07:11:31 pm »
Watching Arsenal of the latter 6 years as opposed to the Arsenal in Wenger's first 6 years is like watching a cartoon Disney version of an action blockbuster PG rated movie. If they only grew up watching the cartoon version, things aren't so bad, but if they grew up watching the movies it just make them sick to their stomach watching Arsenal capitulate and slip behind in the title race at almost the exact time every year.

Wenger's completely built his team as per his vision, and they've been around together long enough to have learnt the system and understood how everyone moves and plays, yet they're still stagnant.   He's been their long enough and they aren't any closer now to winning the league than they were when they were saving cash to fund their stadium. Top 4 is no longer a guarantee for them either.
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40835 on: December 19, 2016, 07:56:55 pm »
Arsenal manager Arsene Wenger claimed referees are protected "like lions in the zoo"
following a week in which he has been left angered by what he considered contentious decisions by officials....  ;D

What next... ?
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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40836 on: December 19, 2016, 08:00:44 pm »
1 of them has only been 28 for 13 and a half hours. He hasn't became a geriatric overnight you know.

He was talking about guys under 27, so Sanchez has been out of that club for a year plus 13 and a half hours. Clearly not an accusation that Sanchez is done or anything ridiculous like that - he was just saying that the Arsenal attackers as a group weren't as young as he thought they were.

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40837 on: December 19, 2016, 10:59:36 pm »
Watching Arsenal of the latter 6 years as opposed to the Arsenal in Wenger's first 6 years is like watching a cartoon Disney version of an action blockbuster PG rated movie. If they only grew up watching the cartoon version, things aren't so bad, but if they grew up watching the movies it just make them sick to their stomach watching Arsenal capitulate and slip behind in the title race at almost the exact time every year.

And a Mouriniho team is like watching the prequel trilogy?
"All the lads have been talking about is walking out in front of the Kop, with 40,000 singing 'You'll Never Walk Alone'," Collins told BBC Radio Solent. "All the money in the world couldn't buy that feeling," he added.

Offline Ashburton

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40838 on: December 20, 2016, 04:57:52 pm »
I wonder how much of this poor form is down to Mustafi's absence. It's amazing how much difference a good defender can make to how an entire team plays. Not just through lack of individual errors, but by allowing the entire team to play further up the pitch and giving the midfield more confidence to attack.

I don't think it's a coincidence that they've lost the two (very winnable) games that he's missed.

He's been solid, distributes well, and his leadership qualities are the opposite of Gabriel.  As I said before, Holding needs to replace him, because whilst he may be 20, you don't see him booting it to row Z as soon as he gets the ball.  It isn't just that, of course, the entire performance of the team has been poor, with only Sanchez, Bellerin and Koscielny showing up for most of the season.

Well I think I said a week ago these 2 games will go a big way to defining our season & they failed miserably. I didn't see the 2nd half today but it sounds like it's identical to the Everton game, early lead, play ok, should have been ruthless when on top, concede an equaliser & look totally abject 2nd half.

They deserve al the criticism they are going to get I my opinion. All the players talk about winning the league, but in my opinion there's a select few who really want to put in the hard work & effort to win it, the rest would like to win it, but only if it gets placed into their lap.

Agreed.  As I said pre-game, aren't going to get a better time to beat City.  Turned up for 45 minutes in both those games, I don't know what he says at half time but the team flatlined in the second half.  I think it goes back to the players feeling too safe, too loved regardless of their performance, and the manager isn't making their life harsh enough when they are shit for them to pull the finger out. 

Except today Arsenal were never on top -- apart from scoring early, they were totally dominated and outclassed by Man City.

Just wrong, first half went as many fans had hoped, indeed how the fixture went last year where we won 2-1.  Defended well, broke quickly, and as a team did what they needed to do, stay compact.  In the second half this level dropped massively.

Why is it funny?  Every year it's the same old, same old.  Maybe some of their fans would like to win the title, to win the European Cup.  To do more than be at the top table every year, without being the best.

Wenger has done some wonderful things for that club, and perhaps getting someone else in means they finish 6th and aren't in the Champions League.  But given that they aren't going to win it with Wenger in charge, what difference does it make?  They might be worse without him, but they aren't going to be better with him, so why shouldn't fans want a change?

My own personal view, is that finishing top 4 every season, without ever kicking on and having a proper challenge of the title, is getting rather old.  I'm concerned Wenger does not have it in his locker to galvanize the team to kick on, band together and grind out the results you need.  Recent history has shown, season after season, in big games, there is something missing.  I believe he's going to get a new contract in the New Year, however, so am not holding out much hope for Simeone to come in on huge money and bollock anyone who doesn't put the effort in (and sell them to WBA as penance).

Monreal is patently not good enough for Arsenal if they want to win the league. Lets them down too often. It's a shame for them because imo Cech, Bellerin and Koscielny definitely are (Mustafi yet to be seen).

Monreal's had quite a dip in form this season, especially as he was playing for the NT ahead of Alba not too long back.  He's lost a yard of pace, personally I'd like to see Gibbs getting a run of games, can't be any worse.

How much is he after again? 300k a week? Christ Almighty.

150k really, as he doesn't come out of the tunnel for the second half.

Offline Red Bird

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Re: General Arsenal Thread
« Reply #40839 on: December 22, 2016, 05:35:20 am »
Did Sanchez actually say he finds London life stressful? I thought one of the reasons he chose Arsenal over Liverpool was because of the pull of London or did I miss something?