Author Topic: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence  (Read 13786 times)

Offline telekon

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The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« on: November 11, 2015, 02:53:38 pm »



We are on the edge of change comparable to the rise of human life on Earth. — Vernor Vinge

This article is a proper mind blowing experience. While it starts a bit slow, basically explaining exponential growth, it really catches on. I'd love to hear comments from more scientifically advanced people than myself.  :)

I was unable to find a proper thread on AI, but apologies if it should be merged.

http://waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artificial-intelligence-revolution-1.html#1
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Offline conman

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2015, 03:07:00 pm »
Looking forward to reading your article there..


Timely post too, considering the huge news that Google have just this week open sourced part of their AI ingine "Trensor Flow".

Matt Cutts ‏@mattcutts  Nov 9
BREAKING: Google open-sourcing TensorFlow, its machine learning system: https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2015/11/tensorflow-smarter-machine-learning-for.html

This is huge.

Matt Cutt's (head of Google Web spam) thoughts are below:

Google is open sourcing TensorFlow, its machine learning system

This is huge news, for at least a few reasons:

1. Machine learning is going to have a massive impact on the world. We've already seen that in areas from voice recognition to image understanding to language translation. In many ways, applying machine learning to problems unlocks all kinds of new opportunities. Tons of niches would support specialized startups applying machine learning to specific domains.

2. In the past, Google has released papers like MapReduce, which described a system for massive parallel processing of data. MapReduce spawned entire cottage industries such as Hadoop as smart folks outside Google wrote code to recreate Google's paper. But the results still suffered from a telephone-like effect as outside code ran into issues that may have already been resolved within Google. Now Google is releasing its own code. This offers a massive set of possibilities, without reinventing the wheel.

3. In many ways, machine learning has been an example of "secret sauce." I'm incredibly excited that Google is releasing technology so that the entire world can benefit, not just Google. It's the kind of decision that makes me proud of Google and its people.

Smart people and smart companies often succeed by noticing when something has changed in the world, because change unlocks new opportunities. Well, something has changed. If you're still in school, starting out, or working at a smart company, please think hard about how you could make the world better by applying machine learning to an important issue or a problem that you know well. With TensorFlow now open source, you have a great new tool at your disposal.


http://googleresearch.blogspot.ie/2015/11/tensorflow-googles-latest-machine_9.html
http://www.wired.com/2015/11/google-open-sources-its-artificial-intelligence-engine/

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2015, 03:13:42 pm »
Looking forward to reading your article there..


Timely post too, considering the huge news that Google have just this week open sourced part of their AI ingine "Trensor Flow".

Matt Cutts ‏@mattcutts  Nov 9
BREAKING: Google open-sourcing TensorFlow, its machine learning system: https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2015/11/tensorflow-smarter-machine-learning-for.html

This is huge.

Matt Cutt's (head of Google Web spam) thoughts are below:

Google is open sourcing TensorFlow, its machine learning system

This is huge news, for at least a few reasons:

1. Machine learning is going to have a massive impact on the world. We've already seen that in areas from voice recognition to image understanding to language translation. In many ways, applying machine learning to problems unlocks all kinds of new opportunities. Tons of niches would support specialized startups applying machine learning to specific domains.

2. In the past, Google has released papers like MapReduce, which described a system for massive parallel processing of data. MapReduce spawned entire cottage industries such as Hadoop as smart folks outside Google wrote code to recreate Google's paper. But the results still suffered from a telephone-like effect as outside code ran into issues that may have already been resolved within Google. Now Google is releasing its own code. This offers a massive set of possibilities, without reinventing the wheel.

3. In many ways, machine learning has been an example of "secret sauce." I'm incredibly excited that Google is releasing technology so that the entire world can benefit, not just Google. It's the kind of decision that makes me proud of Google and its people.

Smart people and smart companies often succeed by noticing when something has changed in the world, because change unlocks new opportunities. Well, something has changed. If you're still in school, starting out, or working at a smart company, please think hard about how you could make the world better by applying machine learning to an important issue or a problem that you know well. With TensorFlow now open source, you have a great new tool at your disposal.


http://googleresearch.blogspot.ie/2015/11/tensorflow-googles-latest-machine_9.html
http://www.wired.com/2015/11/google-open-sources-its-artificial-intelligence-engine/


hmmmmmmm how about putting it in charge of all our nuclear missiles? what could possibly go wrong?

Offline conman

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2015, 03:20:59 pm »
hmmmmmmm how about putting it in charge of all our nuclear missiles? what could possibly go wrong?
are you fission?

Offline telekon

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2015, 03:22:53 pm »
What has the universe got to do with it? You're here in Brooklyn! Brooklyn is not expanding!

Offline Bird Bird Bird The Bird Is The Word

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2015, 08:25:01 am »
Might as well just read Bostrom's book.

Offline Andy @ Allerton!

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2015, 01:42:46 pm »
I think therefore I A?
Quote from: tubby on Today at 12:45:53 pm

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Offline bobadicious

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2016, 12:38:01 pm »
Anybody watching the Deepmind Challenge which will lead to the emergence of AI and coming of Judgement Day?

http://www.techradar.com/news/world-of-tech/live-stream-watch-google-s-deepmind-ai-program-take-on-a-human-go-champion-1316512

<a href="http://cdn-static.denofgeek.com/sites/denofgeek/files/styles/article_main_wide_image/public/3/05//terminator_1_0.jpg?itok=kixb6AHo" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://cdn-static.denofgeek.com/sites/denofgeek/files/styles/article_main_wide_image/public/3/05//terminator_1_0.jpg?itok=kixb6AHo</a>
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Offline Twelfth Man

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2016, 12:45:50 pm »



Almost finished this, must admit I lean more towards the sceptical side.
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Offline zabadoh

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2016, 07:35:30 am »
Anybody watching the Deepmind Challenge which will lead to the emergence of AI and coming of Judgement Day?

http://www.techradar.com/news/world-of-tech/live-stream-watch-google-s-deepmind-ai-program-take-on-a-human-go-champion-1316512

<a href="http://cdn-static.denofgeek.com/sites/denofgeek/files/styles/article_main_wide_image/public/3/05//terminator_1_0.jpg?itok=kixb6AHo" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://cdn-static.denofgeek.com/sites/denofgeek/files/styles/article_main_wide_image/public/3/05//terminator_1_0.jpg?itok=kixb6AHo</a>


I am.  The human, Lee Sedol of Korea, the best player in the world for the last 10 years, lost the first 3 matches out of the 5 game series, but the last 2 matches will be played for research purposes.

Lee did win the 4th match on Saturday, following the same line of thought that he blundered in Match 2, but correcting his mistake.

Match 5 is on Monday.

You can watch it being played at 13:00 Korean time (+9 GMT).  Each match lasts 4-5 hours.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP7jMXSY2xbc3KCAE0MHQ-A

Expert analysis of each match is also available on the Youtube channel.
“It's impossible,” said Pride.  “It's risky,” said Experience.  “It's pointless,” said Reason.

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Offline bobadicious

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2016, 02:05:48 pm »
I am.  The human, Lee Sedol of Korea, the best player in the world for the last 10 years, lost the first 3 matches out of the 5 game series, but the last 2 matches will be played for research purposes.

Lee did win the 4th match on Saturday, following the same line of thought that he blundered in Match 2, but correcting his mistake.

Match 5 is on Monday.

You can watch it being played at 13:00 Korean time (+9 GMT).  Each match lasts 4-5 hours.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP7jMXSY2xbc3KCAE0MHQ-A

Expert analysis of each match is also available on the Youtube channel.


Deepmind won the last game to make it a 4-1 win for the robots. It obviously just assimilated the information from its loss and adapted like the Borg to become even stronger trouncing the pesky human in the last game.   
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Offline Packalacky

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2016, 06:49:33 pm »
It's a great step for AI.

Here's a really good podcast about AI and how it might not end very well for us:

The Guardian: How super AI could end the age of humans

Offline zabadoh

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2016, 03:23:45 am »
Deepmind won the last game to make it a 4-1 win for the robots. It obviously just assimilated the information from its loss and adapted like the Borg to become even stronger trouncing the pesky human in the last game.   

It was a close match going down to the nitty gritty end game before Lee resigned.

My wife couldn't watch her Korean soap operas because the Korean channel was covering this match :)
“It's impossible,” said Pride.  “It's risky,” said Experience.  “It's pointless,” said Reason.

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Offline Ken-Obi

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2016, 04:25:17 am »
As the emergence of the homo sapiens gradually wiped out all other human species, will AI then wipe us out?

Imagine 2000 years from now AI children like Sati speaking learning about the remnants of an extinct race called homo sapiens, uncovering records of Lady Gaga, Everton and chicken tikka masala?

Or is this the next step in the human evolution via bionic and/or digital transfer of the human person into cyberspace? Would the human hive mind then eliminate all wars and achieve a unity? Would we then survive the trip to Proxima Centauri as ageless beings, photons etc.
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Offline Gnurglan

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2016, 11:45:16 am »
Every time I hear or read about AI, I think "I Robot".

Compare superintelligence to how we deal with nuclear power. Both needs to be handled with great care.

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Offline zabadoh

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2016, 06:16:37 pm »
Or is this the next step in the human evolution via bionic and/or digital transfer of the human person into cyberspace? Would the human hive mind then eliminate all wars and achieve a unity? Would we then survive the trip to Proxima Centauri as ageless beings, photons etc.

A disembodied mind, freed from aging and disease, will probably lose its sense of sympathy with "body-encumbered" minds and can't really be considered human.

Corporate entities are bad enough, acting psychopathically to the detriment of humans, even though they are comprised of humans.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Corporation_%28film%29

Imagine a super-intelligence that can think at lightning speed with perfect strategy that has no sympathy for human beings?
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Offline vblfc

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #16 on: May 15, 2016, 01:18:46 pm »
Seems for some time now there are (at least) 2 projected paths towards an AI world - (i) Physical with more ideas of robots, smart machines etc. and (ii) a more virtual path where all you need is a connection, a virtual room or pod and maybe a butt plug and you will be in a matrix type world where travel, offices, shops, etc. don't need to exist. 

This comes pretty quickly in a way.  2 years ago I was trying to moderate my kids access, use of phone etc. Nowadays - forget it, the kids & the world are racing towards digital & virtual.

This second scenario seems to be the safest, cheapest, but obviously the less physical route.  So I imagine, in the next few years, that I will be able to have that night out for a romantic dinner with Marilyn Monroe I had dreamed of.......

So when the ultimate question is posed to the Singleton ASI it can come from a person or group who could consult with Gandhi, Mandela, Mother Theresa, etc. or that other group that consult to Stalin, Hitler, Khan, Thatcher.

Could go either way...... 

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #17 on: May 17, 2016, 12:02:44 pm »
The problem you have is that anything that is put out there can (And will be) modified and upgraded and revised and improved in ever increasing cycles. Hardware and Memory capabilities will continue exponentially and upgrades will improve improvements recursively.

Quote from: tubby on Today at 12:45:53 pm

They both went in high, that's factually correct, both tried to play the ball at height.  Doku with his foot, Mac Allister with his chest.

Offline carling

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #18 on: May 17, 2016, 10:15:24 pm »
Wow what a cracking article, thanks OP I enjoyed that.

As discussed in the article, I'm one of those who just doesn't believe we will ever properly code or replicate human intelligence.  It's interesting to ponder what would happen if we did ...  But I think AI will advance and advance and do all sorts of wonderful things, yet will always fall short of the human brain it would need to become 'artificial super intelligence'.

It might sound stupid, but one outcome not discussed is if between gaining human intelligence and super intelligence, the AI simply falls into an exception and crashes like any other piece of software can.  Take the hand-writing AI as an example.  It's aim is to get better at hand-writing and to teach itself, as it scales up and up, more and more variables are involved, I think at some point it comes across a scenario that makes it fall over.  That's all I can imagine happening before it gets to the stage where it decides killing all humans is the way to go.  I don't see how humans can write a piece of code so pure that it can lead to all that... even if the AI is self-learning it still has another objective which surely can't be applied forever at any scale.  I can't see AI destroying human life by accident, there would have to be something more sinister in the initial code.

Offline MBL?

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #19 on: June 4, 2016, 02:16:06 am »
That article in the op scared the shit out of me. It's the logic in it that scares me. Maybe I'm missing something but it sounds very plausible.

If ever there was a time I wanted Alan to come into a thread and rubbish a shite story it's now.

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #20 on: June 4, 2016, 02:20:48 am »
Wow what a cracking article, thanks OP I enjoyed that.

As discussed in the article, I'm one of those who just doesn't believe we will ever properly code or replicate human intelligence.  It's interesting to ponder what would happen if we did ...  But I think AI will advance and advance and do all sorts of wonderful things, yet will always fall short of the human brain it would need to become 'artificial super intelligence'.

It might sound stupid, but one outcome not discussed is if between gaining human intelligence and super intelligence, the AI simply falls into an exception and crashes like any other piece of software can.  Take the hand-writing AI as an example.  It's aim is to get better at hand-writing and to teach itself, as it scales up and up, more and more variables are involved, I think at some point it comes across a scenario that makes it fall over.  That's all I can imagine happening before it gets to the stage where it decides killing all humans is the way to go.  I don't see how humans can write a piece of code so pure that it can lead to all that... even if the AI is self-learning it still has another objective which surely can't be applied forever at any scale.  I can't see AI destroying human life by accident, there would have to be something more sinister in the initial code.
Since it had gained intelligence wouldn't it write it's own code to replace or better itself?

Offline carling

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #21 on: June 7, 2016, 03:29:18 pm »
Since it had gained intelligence wouldn't it write it's own code to replace or better itself?

But that's when it would be at it's most vulnerable.  If it is going back to its original code, it could seriously mess things up. 

Here's a good article (not as long as the op), talking about this theory and how a budding ASI would want humans around to flick a 'reset' switch - https://www.singularityweblog.com/humanity-and-artificial-superintelligence/

Not that I think we're ever getting that far by the way.

Offline CraigDS

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #22 on: July 6, 2016, 10:47:37 am »
And now they are teaching robots to learn how to hunt. We're gonna be our own downfall.

https://www.engadget.com/2016/07/05/robots-hunt-prey/

Offline thisyearisouryear

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #23 on: October 17, 2016, 02:52:57 pm »
Very interesting if the bot/app can mimic the specific human personality quite closely.

https://fossbytes.com/programmer-kept-talking-friend-death-using-ai/


Offline vagabond

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #24 on: November 25, 2016, 07:55:53 pm »
https://aeon.co/essays/true-ai-is-both-logically-possible-and-utterly-implausible

This article is a good summary about the predictions around 'superintelligent machines'. It's a fanciful idea that is utterly implausible.
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Offline Show Me The Exit

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #25 on: November 26, 2016, 02:49:18 pm »
Thanks for the link - his argument seems to revolve around AI being implausible because "it  just is" since we don't understand our own minds sufficiently yet to be able to engineer it.

However, in my opinion, it is not only plausible but certain that true AI will soon arrive as an emergent property the same way that human consciousness, or city design or bacterial super-resistance has.

Order does not have to be planned, it only requires the correct preconditions to be in place - which they are - which is why we see the acceleration of the rate of both technology and intelligence with time.
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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #26 on: November 26, 2016, 11:37:38 pm »
Thanks for the link - his argument seems to revolve around AI being implausible because "it  just is" since we don't understand our own minds sufficiently yet to be able to engineer it.

However, in my opinion, it is not only plausible but certain that true AI will soon arrive as an emergent property the same way that human consciousness, or city design or bacterial super-resistance has.

Order does not have to be planned, it only requires the correct preconditions to be in place - which they are - which is why we see the acceleration of the rate of both technology and intelligence with time.

I think there was slightly more to his argument than that :)

As he says, all computers (that we are currently capable of engineering) are turing machines. All turing machines are mere syntactic engines. A syntactic engine, by definition, cannot know or understanding anything because it lacks semantics. Computers are glorified calculators that are getting better and faster at manipulating meaningless strings of binary all the time. If you feel that this is sufficient for grounding an actual intelligent being then the onus should be on you to show exactly how you derive semantics from pure syntax.
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Offline Show Me The Exit

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2016, 03:23:03 pm »
Of course I was parsing!  ;D

I suppose the process would be the same as the evolution of intelligence in the glorified calulators in our own heads. If our intelligence has evolved from the likes of sea-sponges via a series of increasingly complicated biological transistors why would that process come to a halt with silicon-based units that are capable of performing the same task?

Of course saying that all current computers cannot, by definition, feel is correct but what is the biological hurdle that needs to be overcome?

We are ourselves inferior copies of the computers that have come before us.
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Offline vagabond

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #28 on: November 29, 2016, 02:38:33 pm »
Of course I was parsing!  ;D

I suppose the process would be the same as the evolution of intelligence in the glorified calulators in our own heads. If our intelligence has evolved from the likes of sea-sponges via a series of increasingly complicated biological transistors why would that process come to a halt with silicon-based units that are capable of performing the same task?

There are a number of assumptions here that each need to be justified.
Firstly, you need to show that the brain is a computer. There is no functional analogue to a transistor in the brain, that's just not how it works.
Secondly, you need to show that if the brain is a computer that it is specifically a turing machine. There's a lot of work done on this, especially in areas like connectionism, that show that even if we reduce the brain's activity to mere computation, the turing machine paradigm is incapable of fully accounting for the brain's abilities.
Thirdly, you need to show that even if the brain is a turing machine that emergentism is a valid theory. This is the hard part. After all, emergentism is basically the admission that we cannot explain how consciousness actually works but we know it must be natural and must be connected to the brain so it must have emerged at some point in evolution. It's about as far from an explanatory thesis as its possible to get - it just turns consciousness into a brute fact that just so happened to happen but we have no idea how it happened. That seems to me to be a poor thesis to put your faith in for artificial intelligence. Perhaps a turing machine that is manipulating arbitrary symbols will one day 'wake up' to itself and be a conscious being. But if the explanation for this is emergentism then it will be just an inexplicable an event as biological matter becoming conscious. How can anyone have any certainty in the matter?

Quote
Of course saying that all current computers cannot, by definition, feel is correct but what is the biological hurdle that needs to be overcome?

We need a theory of how syntax can give rise to semantics. How is it that a computer processing binary data over and over again will begin to have truth-evaluable conscious experiences? That seems to me to be a fantastic leap. If it is possible then we need a solid theory of how it is possible, otherwise it's just magical thinking.

Quote
We are ourselves inferior copies of the computers that have come before us.

I'm not sure I know what you mean here.
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Offline Show Me The Exit

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #29 on: November 30, 2016, 11:11:51 am »
Great discussion!  :D

There are a number of assumptions here that each need to be justified.
Firstly, you need to show that the brain is a computer. There is no functional analogue to a transistor in the brain, that's just not how it works.

Why not? We know at the most basic level that the brain works via a series of electrochemical switches between neuronal connections - why is this not analagous to a series of transistors?

Or are you referring to the mind rather than the brain? In which case I agree there is no unifying theory of mind however the underlying organ from which it arises (the brain) is structured as I have described (unless you have another theory which I'd be most interested to hear).


Secondly, you need to show that if the brain is a computer that it is specifically a turing machine. There's a lot of work done on this, especially in areas like connectionism, that show that even if we reduce the brain's activity to mere computation, the turing machine paradigm is incapable of fully accounting for the brain's abilities.

Is this not a circular argument though? Previously you mentioned that the brain is by definition not a Turing machine therefore it can feel and emote and a computer (which is a Turing machine) can "by definition" do none of these things.

Yet a sea sponge is comprised of a very simple neural net  - and I would argue, a series of simple biological switches (or transistors) yet we (and our intelligence/conscious etc) have evolved from primitive animals such as these by making repeated imperfect copies over aeons (hence my comment above that I didn't explain very well!)

Thirdly, you need to show that even if the brain is a turing machine that emergentism is a valid theory. This is the hard part. After all, emergentism is basically the admission that we cannot explain how consciousness actually works but we know it must be natural and must be connected to the brain so it must have emerged at some point in evolution. It's about as far from an explanatory thesis as its possible to get - it just turns consciousness into a brute fact that just so happened to happen but we have no idea how it happened. That seems to me to be a poor thesis to put your faith in for artificial intelligence. Perhaps a turing machine that is manipulating arbitrary symbols will one day 'wake up' to itself and be a conscious being. But if the explanation for this is emergentism then it will be just an inexplicable an event as biological matter becoming conscious. How can anyone have any certainty in the matter?

Good question - but we surely can't limit ourselves to things we only have certainty in?

I would say that there is a good deal of evidence for emergence - as you say in consciousness, evolution and so on. With the correct underlying conditions, complex order can emerge.

And what is the alternative? That someone is designing these things? Also possible but likely impossible to prove.

How could we really prove that a machine could be sentient anyway? How would we even prove that anyone else (apart from your own self) is?

We need a theory of how syntax can give rise to semantics. How is it that a computer processing binary data over and over again will begin to have truth-evaluable conscious experiences? That seems to me to be a fantastic leap. If it is possible then we need a solid theory of how it is possible, otherwise it's just magical thinking.

This would be a necessary but not sufficient step for explaining our consciousness.

I guess that if you and I were to take a trip in a time machine to see the spawning of the first amoeba we could describe the development of sophisticated forms of consciousness as "magical thinking" and yet here we are!

These are all great questions - for me the premise of my argument remains - what is there to STOP the ongoing march of intelligence emerging over time (which hopefully you will agree there is a lot of evidence for)?

The underlying point seems to be that there is something inherently different about a biological circuit conducting electrical impulses compared to a silicon circuit. What that property is nobody can yet identify or explain - isn't that the real magical thinking here?

Copernicus, Darwin and Freud progressively showed how man was not central in the grand schemes of nature and I think that, one day, another name will be added to that list and his/her achievement will be to show that consciousness (as far as it can be proven) can be created digitally.

We are of course limited in being able to understand the question through the prism of our own minds but these are great problems to chew over.
Mate, with all due respect, you are an absolute fucking fruit case -MOZ

Seriously mate - You post such utter fucking gash with such conviction it's quite spell binding. - Alan_X

Offline vagabond

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #30 on: December 2, 2016, 12:34:13 am »
Great discussion!  :D

Why not? We know at the most basic level that the brain works via a series of electrochemical switches between neuronal connections - why is this not analagous to a series of transistors?

Or are you referring to the mind rather than the brain? In which case I agree there is no unifying theory of mind however the underlying organ from which it arises (the brain) is structured as I have described (unless you have another theory which I'd be most interested to hear).

The following is a good summary of why the "brain is a computer" is just a metaphor.

"Senses, reflexes and learning mechanisms – this is what we start with, and it is quite a lot, when you think about it. If we lacked any of these capabilities at birth, we would probably have trouble surviving.

But here is what we are not born with: information, data, rules, software, knowledge, lexicons, representations, algorithms, programs, models, memories, images, processors, subroutines, encoders, decoders, symbols, or buffers – design elements that allow digital computers to behave somewhat intelligently. Not only are we not born with such things, we also don’t develop them – ever.

We don’t store words or the rules that tell us how to manipulate them. We don’t create representations of visual stimuli, store them in a short-term memory buffer, and then transfer the representation into a long-term memory device. We don’t retrieve information or images or words from memory registers. Computers do all of these things, but organisms do not.

Computers, quite literally, process information – numbers, letters, words, formulas, images. The information first has to be encoded into a format computers can use, which means patterns of ones and zeroes (‘bits’) organised into small chunks (‘bytes’). On my computer, each byte contains 64 bits, and a certain pattern of those bits stands for the letter d, another for the letter o, and another for the letter g. Side by side, those three bytes form the word dog. One single image – say, the photograph of my cat Henry on my desktop – is represented by a very specific pattern of a million of these bytes (‘one megabyte’), surrounded by some special characters that tell the computer to expect an image, not a word."

(link: https://aeon.co/essays/your-brain-does-not-process-information-and-it-is-not-a-computer)

Computation is a useful metaphor by which we can study the brain but it does no explanatory work. It may even be a correct analogy. But we can't just assume this. We need some theory of why neural processing is akin to computational processing. I haven't come across any in the cognitive science literature myself yet. It is possible that the brain is just a computer but for now, it's just a metaphor.

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Is this not a circular argument though? Previously you mentioned that the brain is by definition not a Turing machine therefore it can feel and emote and a computer (which is a Turing machine) can "by definition" do none of these things.

Yet a sea sponge is comprised of a very simple neural net  - and I would argue, a series of simple biological switches (or transistors) yet we (and our intelligence/conscious etc) have evolved from primitive animals such as these by making repeated imperfect copies over aeons (hence my comment above that I didn't explain very well!)

You are right, let me rephrase my point better. I am claiming that a Turing machine, by definition, cannot be conscious. This is because of how it works. It literally parses strings of binary over and over again, given whatever a human inputs it with and outputs another string of meaningless binary that some other human interprets as having meaning. As far as the computer is concerned, it has never encountered meaning at all.

If the brain is a turing machine then either we have misunderstood how a turing machine works or there is more to these strings of binary than we previously thought. Somehow they must encode semantic information too, and not just be syntactic engines. How is this possible? What is the theory behind it? If AI is truly possible, and a turing machine can feel, think and actually mean what it says then we need to explain how this is possible.

This is the problem with sea sponge example. Sure, I can see how dim workings of semantic information in a sea sponge can evolve into a human writing a symphony or programming a computer, but the really hard step is getting to that semantics in the first place. Do bacteria have mental states with semantic information? What's the difference? What are we adding to syntax to get there?

I'm not asking all these questions as a rhetorical device but because this truly is the state of our understanding of how our brain works, and the crude analogy between it and a computer. We don't have any of the basics worked out. These are important questions and neither you nor I have an answer to them.

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Good question - but we surely can't limit ourselves to things we only have certainty in?

I would say that there is a good deal of evidence for emergence - as you say in consciousness, evolution and so on. With the correct underlying conditions, complex order can emerge.

And what is the alternative? That someone is designing these things? Also possible but likely impossible to prove.

How could we really prove that a machine could be sentient anyway? How would we even prove that anyone else (apart from your own self) is?

No, of course, many prominent philosophers, cognitive scientists, neuroscientists, computer scientists etc etc are betting on the emergentism horse. There's nothing wrong with thinking it's the right story. But it's one thing to say that "well, we don't know how consciousness happened but it must have emerged out of matter somehow" because all the other options (physicalism, dualism, idealism(!)) seem to be worse. But AI isn't a real phenomenon that already exists and must be explained somehow (thus allowing ourselves to back a poor theory just because all the other options are worse). Rather, you're using a poor theory that does no explanatory work in one realm to make predictions about how and why AI will definitely come about. This is an unwarranted step. AI isn't even a reality, so why should we explain it using a poor theory? Let's at least try to justify our belief that AI is possible using more than a hand-waving argument.

I get the impression you are not a full-blown emergentist, the idea that 'out of compexity order emerges' seems to suggest that there is something about the underlying conditions, as you put it, that make it the case that consciousness emerges. So what is it about the underlying conditions then that cause consciousness? There's an interesting paper on this regard by Eric Schwitzgebel. If all it takes is the underlying conditions, that is, the material conditions, to be in the right order for consciousness to emerge, then the United States is probably conscious (link: http://www.faculty.ucr.edu/~eschwitz/SchwitzPapers/USAconscious-140130a.htm). That seems to me to be an incredible result (if you buy his argument). It's well worth a read anyway because of how well written it is and how clearly it grasps these issues. In any case, I think we need more constraints on how matter must be arranged and what it must do for consciousness to happen. But we have no theory for these constraints and we have only the one example of it here on earth of how it is empirically. There's just not enough data to make a case for "complexity => order" here. I don't mean to dismiss it, it's an interesting idea but what's the evidence?


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This would be a necessary but not sufficient step for explaining our consciousness.

I guess that if you and I were to take a trip in a time machine to see the spawning of the first amoeba we could describe the development of sophisticated forms of consciousness as "magical thinking" and yet here we are!

These are all great questions - for me the premise of my argument remains - what is there to STOP the ongoing march of intelligence emerging over time (which hopefully you will agree there is a lot of evidence for)?

The underlying point seems to be that there is something inherently different about a biological circuit conducting electrical impulses compared to a silicon circuit. What that property is nobody can yet identify or explain - isn't that the real magical thinking here?

Copernicus, Darwin and Freud progressively showed how man was not central in the grand schemes of nature and I think that, one day, another name will be added to that list and his/her achievement will be to show that consciousness (as far as it can be proven) can be created digitally.

We are of course limited in being able to understand the question through the prism of our own minds but these are great problems to chew over.

I agree, it is a mystery. But what we have evidence for is biological intelligence. It's entirely possible, maybe even probable, that a more intelligent species will come along after we are long gone. But no computer is intelligent. No computer has ever been intelligent and until we can say exactly how computational intelligence will work, we have no good reason to believe that any computer will ever be intelligent either.
Sometimes a man stands up during supper
and walks outdoors, and keeps on walking,
because of a church that stands somewhere in the East.
---Rilke

Offline HelterSkelter

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #31 on: December 3, 2016, 01:48:36 am »
One of the reasons for expecting emergence is because everything about the universe seems to have followed that path.

The fundamental forces of nature + hydrogen, gave rise to the first stars, which in turn provided the elements, stars, solar systems, galaxies and ultimately life. Our intelligence emerged from the interactions of one element, every atom in our bodies has spent time in a star, floating in the void, and part of every type of inert matter from asphalt to zinc.

Computers will soon outstrip our brains in sheer power, but sentience from that point seems far more probable than the journey we've made from a small mammal to now, never mind the brainless ancestors we have that did nothing more than convert sunlight.
Plus we had to rely on evolution, computers have a creator that can bring that sentience in a fraction of the time.

We are a fragile entity that has a very very narrow suitability to this universe. If a computer ever becomes self aware then it seems to me that the universe is designed for them to exploit in the same way we colonized the land while our fishy cousins stagnated in the ocean. There would not be a planet too hostile or a journey too far. Its the next step on the evolutionary ladder for me.




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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #32 on: December 6, 2016, 11:19:10 pm »
One of the reasons for expecting emergence is because everything about the universe seems to have followed that path.

The fundamental forces of nature + hydrogen, gave rise to the first stars, which in turn provided the elements, stars, solar systems, galaxies and ultimately life. Our intelligence emerged from the interactions of one element, every atom in our bodies has spent time in a star, floating in the void, and part of every type of inert matter from asphalt to zinc.

We have a well worked out theory of how the emergent phenomena of macro-objects like stars manifest given micro-objects like hydrogen and helium. We have no such theory for how semantics emerges from syntax. The point is not that intelligence cannot emerge from mere calculation but that we have no reason to believe it will because nothing about calculation explains what it means to be intelligent. So, for instance, take the emergence of the property of wetness. Individual H2O molecules do not exhibit this property - it is a property that emerges at the macro-level only. However, we can tell a very good scientific story about why it emerges. We can show how, given the way individual H2O molecules slide over each other, it makes sense that wetness is an emergent property of such objects when collected together in large enough quantities. Notice that the explanation for the emergence of wetness is made in virtue of some property of its constituent parts. Same thing with other emergent phenomena that we can explain.
This is not the current state of AI. In AI, we are assuming that intelligence emerges from computation but what does it emerge from? In virtue of what in the constituent parts of the computation machinery will the property of intelligence emerge? These questions cannot be sidestepped. Until we have a satisfactory answer for them, we have no good reason for believing in emergence.


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Computers will soon outstrip our brains in sheer power, but sentience from that point seems far more probable than the journey we've made from a small mammal to now, never mind the brainless ancestors we have that did nothing more than convert sunlight.
Plus we had to rely on evolution, computers have a creator that can bring that sentience in a fraction of the time.

If we can bring sentience in the fraction of the time that evolution can then how will we do it? How exactly do we create sentience? Why haven't we done it already if we can? What's taking so long? If somebody had an actual theory of how to create sentience, that person would be a scientific superstar. Sadly no such theory exists. This is why every prediction of AI is always made about some time in the nebulous future, not too far off so as to continue to titillate, but far enough that they can't be called on their bogus prediction.


 
Quote
We are a fragile entity that has a very very narrow suitability to this universe. If a computer ever becomes self aware then it seems to me that the universe is designed for them to exploit in the same way we colonized the land while our fishy cousins stagnated in the ocean. There would not be a planet too hostile or a journey too far. Its the next step on the evolutionary ladder for me.

Of course if we do create AI then it does seem conceivable that it will be open to far more possibilities than we will in our fragile biological bodies. But all the work in that conditional claim is taking place in the antecedent clause. If we create AI then x, y and z follow. Sure, I can believe it to be possible, but until that if is realized, it's just science fiction.
Sometimes a man stands up during supper
and walks outdoors, and keeps on walking,
because of a church that stands somewhere in the East.
---Rilke

Offline Show Me The Exit

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #33 on: December 7, 2016, 10:36:29 am »
 Sorry for the late reply – snowed at work rather than thinking up incredible critiques but this thread is really valuable in helping chew over some of these ideas.
The following is a good summary of why the "brain is a computer" is just a metaphor.

"Senses, reflexes and learning mechanisms – this is what we start with, and it is quite a lot, when you think about it. If we lacked any of these capabilities at birth, we would probably have trouble surviving.

But here is what we are not born with: information, data, rules, software, knowledge, lexicons, representations, algorithms, programs, models, memories, images, processors, subroutines, encoders, decoders, symbols, or buffers – design elements that allow digital computers to behave somewhat intelligently. Not only are we not born with such things, we also don’t develop them – ever.
This is a puzzle to me – as far as I see it we ARE born with information, data, software, memories etc. A newly-born baby crawls up his mother’s tummy and clamps on a nipple to suckle. They show a preference for food that the mother has eaten during gestation. Symbols have been shown to develop for both parents in a number of different animal types leading to attachment.  Does the memory of a baby work in the same way as a computer? Of course not – never the less it exists.



Computation is a useful metaphor by which we can study the brain but it does no explanatory work. It may even be a correct analogy. But we can't just assume this. We need some theory of why neural processing is akin to computational processing. I haven't come across any in the cognitive science literature myself yet. It is possible that the brain is just a computer but for now, it's just a metaphor.
We can describe how the brain works on a cellular and molecular level – we cannot do so with the mind that arises from it. But isn’t EVRYTHING we use to describe the mind a metaphor? The problem is that the mind is, by orders of magnitude, the most complex thing that we are aware of in the universe so even the language we use about it is metaphorical in a sense. We can only ever hope to describe facets of it in simpler terms. Language itself is semantic in that sense.

 
If the brain is a turing machine then either we have misunderstood how a turing machine works or there is more to these strings of binary than we previously thought. Somehow they must encode semantic information too, and not just be syntactic engines. How is this possible? What is the theory behind it? If AI is truly possible, and a turing machine can feel, think and actually mean what it says then we need to explain how this is possible.
Explaining how this is possible is certainly an important and interesting question but do we need to be able to explain it in order for it to exist? Every day around the world millions of people are given general anaesthetics – nobody knows how they work yet they exist and novel anaesthetic agents are constantly being developed.

This is the problem with sea sponge example. Sure, I can see how dim workings of semantic information in a sea sponge can evolve into a human writing a symphony or programming a computer, but the really hard step is getting to that semantics in the first place. Do bacteria have mental states with semantic information? What's the difference? What are we adding to syntax to get there?
Is semantics just the “feeling” envinced by the data imputed to the conscious brain? If so, we have evolved to the point where we can roughly pinpoint which areas of the brain are responsible for feelings and emotions and these areas have developed from more “unfeeling”, and simpler, ameobas and sea sponges. This consciousness has arisen via physical means – although as you rightly say we don’t understand the process. From my understanding that means we don’t know whether or not there is a biological hurdle to overcome with manufactured complex systems in order to create true intelligence.
But still, I am leaning towards the opinion that it can emerge if the right underlying characteristics are present and there is a critical mass of computation available – whether or not we understand them (as in the example of anaesthesia).

I get the impression you are not a full-blown emergentist, the idea that 'out of compexity order emerges' seems to suggest that there is something about the underlying conditions, as you put it, that make it the case that consciousness emerges. So what is it about the underlying conditions then that cause consciousness? There's an interesting paper on this regard by Eric Schwitzgebel. If all it takes is the underlying conditions, that is, the material conditions, to be in the right order for consciousness to emerge, then the United States is probably conscious (link: http://www.faculty.ucr.edu/~eschwitz/SchwitzPapers/USAconscious-140130a.htm). That seems to me to be an incredible result (if you buy his argument). It's well worth a read anyway because of how well written it is and how clearly it grasps these issues. In any case, I think we need more constraints on how matter must be arranged and what it must do for consciousness to happen. But we have no theory for these constraints and we have only the one example of it here on earth of how it is empirically. There's just not enough data to make a case for "complexity => order" here. I don't mean to dismiss it, it's an interesting idea but what's the evidence?
You’re right I’m not a full-blown emergentist but am leaning that way. A thousand thankyous for the paper – it’s a question I’ve wrestled with for a while (sometimes in talks I’ve included a slide that shows a neural network next to a satellite shot of any big city at night) and it is described in much better terms than I could ever manage. I do buy into his argument but I don’t think there is enough complexity yet for a higher consciousness to emerge. As you rightly say there is no theory or data to base this on 

I agree, it is a mystery. But what we have evidence for is biological intelligence. It's entirely possible, maybe even probable, that a more intelligent species will come along after we are long gone. But no computer is intelligent. No computer has ever been intelligent and until we can say exactly how computational intelligence will work, we have no good reason to believe that any computer will ever be intelligent either.
Maybe the next realm will come in synthetic –biological amalgams. A cochlear implant is a computer that is surgically implanted to generate sounds in deaf people’s brains. Is this producing semantic information? Does it generate a new form of consciousness? If not, at what point do we decide how much computational vs biological power would count as being able to do so?

Thanks for the discussion – absolutely fascinating -  out of interest I would be really keen to know what your, and Helter Skelter’s,  backgrounds are  if you were able to share them (via PM if you didn’t want a wider audience)?
Mate, with all due respect, you are an absolute fucking fruit case -MOZ

Seriously mate - You post such utter fucking gash with such conviction it's quite spell binding. - Alan_X

Offline vagabond

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2016, 02:25:57 am »
Sorry for the late reply – snowed at work rather than thinking up incredible critiques but this thread is really valuable in helping chew over some of these ideas.

Apologies for the even later response!

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This is a puzzle to me – as far as I see it we ARE born with information, data, software, memories etc. A newly-born baby crawls up his mother’s tummy and clamps on a nipple to suckle. They show a preference for food that the mother has eaten during gestation. Symbols have been shown to develop for both parents in a number of different animal types leading to attachment.  Does the memory of a baby work in the same way as a computer? Of course not – never the less it exists.

I don't think the discussion here is about whether we have memory - whoever would deny that? Rather the discussion is whether the kinds of memory, processing capabilities, data structures and data manipulation undertaken by computation is a good analogue for human cognition. As the article I posted showed, it's merely a metaphor. Just like humans in the 1700s used to use a mill as a metaphor for the brain, because it was the most complex machinery we could think of, we use computers. This doesn't mean it's a good or bad metaphor but that being a suitable metaphor isn't enough to say that computation can have the same, literal, output of consciousness that brains do. To go beyond a metaphor and actually produce a computational model of the brain, we need some actual theory of computational neuroanatomy.

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We can describe how the brain works on a cellular and molecular level – we cannot do so with the mind that arises from it. But isn’t EVRYTHING we use to describe the mind a metaphor? The problem is that the mind is, by orders of magnitude, the most complex thing that we are aware of in the universe so even the language we use about it is metaphorical in a sense. We can only ever hope to describe facets of it in simpler terms. Language itself is semantic in that sense.

 Explaining how this is possible is certainly an important and interesting question but do we need to be able to explain it in order for it to exist? Every day around the world millions of people are given general anaesthetics – nobody knows how they work yet they exist and novel anaesthetic agents are constantly being developed.

But this analogy is the wrong way around. We know anaesthesia works and now have the task of developing an adequate theory for it. The problem with the theory of AI is that we have never seen an actual example of computational, or even non-biological, consciousness in reality. So if we have AI first, then you're warranted in saying 'look it exists and even if we don't know how it exists we can't deny it'.  But in this case, all we have is a metaphor, not even a theory of how it's supposed to happen. Why is this enough to warrant belief in AI?

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Is semantics just the “feeling” envinced by the data imputed to the conscious brain? If so, we have evolved to the point where we can roughly pinpoint which areas of the brain are responsible for feelings and emotions and these areas have developed from more “unfeeling”, and simpler, ameobas and sea sponges. This consciousness has arisen via physical means – although as you rightly say we don’t understand the process. From my understanding that means we don’t know whether or not there is a biological hurdle to overcome with manufactured complex systems in order to create true intelligence.

Semantics is just another word for meaningfulness. So the following string has no semantics: asesadasfrg ha lghgh fdhgnv (for the non-Welsh). A really great thought experiment in this regard is the Chinese Room experiment by John Searle:

"Imagine a native English speaker who knows no Chinese locked in a room full of boxes of Chinese symbols (a data base) together with a book of instructions for manipulating the symbols (the program). Imagine that people outside the room send in other Chinese symbols which, unknown to the person in the room, are questions in Chinese (the input). And imagine that by following the instructions in the program the man in the room is able to pass out Chinese symbols which are correct answers to the questions (the output). The program enables the person in the room to pass the Turing Test for understanding Chinese but he does not understand a word of Chinese."

(More reading here: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/chinese-room/ - highly recommended btw!)

This example neatly shows the difference between semantics and syntax. Sure, a computer can manipulate strings of binary at breathtaking speeds. Even, indeed, fast enough to simulate the appearance of semantics if it is given the right instructions. But it never understands the symbols themselves. This is the key difference between us and the computer. When we learn the Chinese language, we literally understand what the symbols mean.

Another way of thinking about this is through the idea of a truth-maker, or truth-values. For a string of symbols to go from mere syntax to semantics, the string must have some truth-value or truth-maker. That is, there must be some fact about the world that can make that string true or false. If I say "the cat is on the mat" the truth-maker for this string is the truth or falsity of there being a cat on a mat where I am suggesting there is one. But, as far as a computer is concerned, there are no truth-values to the strings it manipulates. It gets a string, and it gets an instruction on what to do with that string, and then it processes that string according to that instruction. If a computer processes a picture and returns the string "the cat is on the mat" if it is instructed to do so given the binary representation of cat and the binary representation of mat are in close proximity this does not mean that the computer has now uttered a sentence that can have a truth-value. As far as the computer is concerned, it does not even know what those binary representations are, let alone that they represent cats, mats or any such item of the world.

Now, there are some strategies open to the AI proponent here. You could say, well the way we, as humans, translate the mere syntax of synoptic chemical exchanges into meaningful thoughts about the world is also a mystery so maybe the way AI will work will be mysterious to us too. This may well be true. But the question here is whether we are warranted in believing that AI is possible given such a mysterious understanding of it. I don't think we have any such warrant even if it does happen, and it does turn out to be mysterious how it happens.
Secondly, you could deny that humans have semantics either. This is a favorite strategy of hardcore eliminative materialists. The thought here is that when I say "the cat is on the mat" I'm just uttering gibberish too, there is no meaningfulness to my utterance and thus, no truth-value to my utterances. The problem here is neatly sidestepped - there just is nothing to explain, humans are the same as computers because our thoughts are just as meaningless as a computer's processing. Now I find this position to be unintelligible. I don't expect many here to find it compelling either so I won't present any explicit criticisms of it.

Suffice to say, humans have meaningful thoughts and computers process meaningless symbols. This is a gap that has to be bridged if you want to show that AI is a real possibility. This is what I mean by the problem of semantics.

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But still, I am leaning towards the opinion that it can emerge if the right underlying characteristics are present and there is a critical mass of computation available – whether or not we understand them (as in the example of anaesthesia).
You’re right I’m not a full-blown emergentist but am leaning that way. A thousand thankyous for the paper – it’s a question I’ve wrestled with for a while (sometimes in talks I’ve included a slide that shows a neural network next to a satellite shot of any big city at night) and it is described in much better terms than I could ever manage. I do buy into his argument but I don’t think there is enough complexity yet for a higher consciousness to emerge. As you rightly say there is no theory or data to base this on 
Maybe the next realm will come in synthetic –biological amalgams. A cochlear implant is a computer that is surgically implanted to generate sounds in deaf people’s brains. Is this producing semantic information? Does it generate a new form of consciousness? If not, at what point do we decide how much computational vs biological power would count as being able to do so?

I would suggest that the cochlear implant is producing semantic information. But I don't think much rests on this. It's basically the same as any other tool we use. If I use an abacus, the way the beads are arranged in their rows mean something to me. I interpret the abacus as transmitting meaningful information to me even if, as far as the abacus is concerned, it doesn't mean anything at all. It's just an inert collection of atoms that have been arranged in a certain order by an intelligent being that wishes to use it as a tool for meaningful engagement with the world. Nobody would seriously suggest that an abacus is conscious. But apparently a billion abacuses being used at mind-bending speeds at once are somehow supposed to convince me that they are conscious?

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Thanks for the discussion – absolutely fascinating -  out of interest I would be really keen to know what your, and Helter Skelter’s,  backgrounds are  if you were able to share them (via PM if you didn’t want a wider audience)?


Thank you too. It is indeed a fascinating topic.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2016, 02:29:47 am by vagabond »
Sometimes a man stands up during supper
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because of a church that stands somewhere in the East.
---Rilke

Offline thisyearisouryear

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #35 on: December 22, 2016, 07:39:20 am »
Don't think this has been posted earlier - http://waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artificial-intelligence-revolution-2.html

Part 2 of the article that OP shared to start the thread.

Offline theMilkman

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #36 on: December 28, 2016, 05:42:54 pm »
https://electrek.co/2016/12/27/tesla-autopilot-radar-technology-predict-accident-dashcam/

This is nuts. Tesla's sonar upgrade predicts a crash before it happens. 
"But the most important thing that we all must remember is that this football club is much more important and bigger than anybody."~ King Kenny Dalglish

Offline SamAteTheRedAcid

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #37 on: December 28, 2016, 06:08:44 pm »
Vagabond, your lengthy post above is very illuminating. Posts like this are just why I love RAWK so much, I just randomly clicked this thread and suddenly my tiny mind is blown ;D
get thee to the library before the c*nts close it down

we are a bunch of twats commenting on a website.

Offline vagabond

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #38 on: December 28, 2016, 08:05:28 pm »
Thanks Sam. I should add that nothing I have said here is all that original, it's all been said before in better ways. I'm just standing on the shoulders of giants. :)
Sometimes a man stands up during supper
and walks outdoors, and keeps on walking,
because of a church that stands somewhere in the East.
---Rilke

Offline The Gulleysucker

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Re: The AI Revolution: The Road to Superintelligence
« Reply #39 on: January 6, 2017, 07:56:38 am »
I'll stick this in here....coming to an Office near you....

Insurance firm Fukoku Mutual Life Insurance is making 34 employees redundant and replacing them with IBM’s Watson Explorer AI

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jan/05/japanese-company-replaces-office-workers-artificial-intelligence-ai-fukoku-mutual-life-insurance



I don't do polite so fuck yoursalf with your stupid accusations...

Right you fuckwit I will show you why you are talking out of your fat arse...

Mutton Geoff (Obviously a real nice guy)