Author Topic: Vatican letter told Ireland's Catholic bishops not to report child abuse  (Read 84135 times)

Offline TepidT2O

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And speak of the Devil: The old nazi himself is the very agent of a insidious criminal conspiracy to shutdown and coverup investigations into child rape within the church. Because that is exactly what god wants and Jesus himself would have done. Suffer the little children..

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/apr/24/children.childprotection

Pope 'obstructed' sex abuse inquiry

Confidential letter reveals Ratzinger ordered bishops to keep allegations secret

Pontifical secret....

What a joke, punish the miscreants within the church by all means, but the obstruct the course of law is a crime and allowed hideous to continue unchecked.....


This could not look worse
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Offline RojoLeón

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Pontifical secret....

What a joke, punish the miscreants within the church by all means, but the obstruct the course of law is a crime and allowed hideous to continue unchecked.....


This could not look worse

All the recent revelations are a disgrace but no surprise. This letter was sent by the current pope over 10 years ago. He should be behind bars. Along with numerous rapists and their colleagues who collaborated in the abuse by perverting the course of justice.

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Cmon guys, God works in mysterious ways and all that. The Pope was just doing what he was told by a higher being. Amazing what you can hide behind religion......
"Woe to you, Oh Earth and Sea, for the Devil sends the beast with wrath, because he knows the time is short...Let him who hath understanding reckon the number of the beast for it is a human number, its number is Six hundred and sixty six."

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On the whole, yes.  At least, from you there is.  You're always outraged, even if Brady stands down you'll still be outraged.  On the internet - outraged.  You may have no faith in God, but have you lost faith in reconciliation?  That's why I said about the Holy Spirit and how it's a bird; as Christians historically we've put too much faith in men, we should look more to God and The Holy Spirit - a more personal faith i suppose.  My Nan grew up in an industrial school in Ireland and when i found out i lost my faith for some time, until i came to think that God may have made man imperfect, he made sorrow and he made grief, but he didn't make industrial schools.  Similarly Christ founded the Catholic Church, but he didn't create the shambles in Ireland at present or the Medicis or Alexander vi or say that The Pope was infallible, it's not God or Jesus that have lost there way, it is us.  I understand outrage, but you shouldn't let it define you. 

None of this defines me, any more than bad things happening to anyone else defines me. The Catholic church never did anything bad to me, other than try to get me to swallow a load of grade A bullshit. I don't give a shit if Brady steps down or not, that's their business, nothing to do with me. Even if he did step down, he would in all likelihood be swept away to Africa to do more evil.

I get it, you know. It's your church, you don't like to see them done down, you'd rather the whole thing went away. Understandable. But here's the thing. Your religious ideas aren't real. They're just ideas, thoughts. You can call it faith, same thing. Men raping children is real. Your believing in a God doesn't (usually) affect anyone else. These fuckers didn't just affect other lives, they ruined them.

Quote
it's not God or Jesus that have lost there way, it is us.

Again (and this time with feeling) speak for yourself. I haven't lost my way. I haven't raped any children. Have you? You basically want us to acknowledge the innate goodness of your religion by admitting we all have our own flaws. In this story, the only flaws lie with your men of God. Don't try to pass it off on everyone and use it to solidify the status of your make believe manbird.

As a good Catholic, and I know a little about them, the only reason you should be in this thread is to acknowledge that your leaders are brutal, arrogant and violent men and then shut the fuck up. To post what you have, wittering on about birds and talking about outrage like it were a Drogba dive and comparing child abuse to goalline technology, and then finally taking the opportunity to remind us how Good your God is and how fucked up we all are? It's pathetic and shameful.

Offline macca888

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He created the devil too, it's a frightening thought really and a hard lesson to learn.

Look, I don't blame you for what has happened obviously. But I blame all Catholics who prevaricate and use nonsense arguments about the devil and the sins of man to essentially absolve the people who covered this up from culpability. Anyone, and I mean anyone, from the lowliest Eucharistic Minister to the Goose Stepping Il Papa, who helped to sweep this under the carpet should be tried in a court of law for their crimes. Your God can forgive them for their sins if he or she wants, but that doesn't equate to justice for the children and families who were the victims. And any Catholic refusing to condemn them for their crimes under the guise of forgiveness doesn't have the first fucking clue about their own Sacraments. Forgiveness can only be given to the contrite in Catholic dogma, and not one of these fuckers has shown the slightest hint of remorse for their part in it. Defending them doesn't make you a better Catholic; it actually makes you a worse one.
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My Italian isn't great but I think this translates as "The Bishop is Not Obliged to Denounce Paedophiles". Which is nice.

Cei: "Il vescovo non ha l'obbligo di denunciare i pedofili"

La Cei ha diramato delle linee guida per quanto riguarda il comportamento dei vescovi nei casi di pedofilia. L'ordinamento parla chiaro, il vescovo non è un pubblico ufficiale e quindi non ha la responsabilità e/o il dovere di denunciare un caso di pedofilia. Allo stesso modo il vescovo è incoraggiato a collaborare con gli inquirenti, "Risulterà importante la cooperazione del vescovo con le autorità civili, nell'ambito delle rispettive competenze".

source

And that says that a bishop is not a public official so therefore has no duty to denounce kiddie rapists. Anyone with more competent Italian, please feel free to correct me.

Offline TepidT2O

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My Italian isn't great but I think this translates as "The Bishop is Not Obliged to Denounce Paedophiles". Which is nice.

Cei: "Il vescovo non ha l'obbligo di denunciare i pedofili"

La Cei ha diramato delle linee guida per quanto riguarda il comportamento dei vescovi nei casi di pedofilia. L'ordinamento parla chiaro, il vescovo non è un pubblico ufficiale e quindi non ha la responsabilità e/o il dovere di denunciare un caso di pedofilia. Allo stesso modo il vescovo è incoraggiato a collaborare con gli inquirenti, "Risulterà importante la cooperazione del vescovo con le autorità civili, nell'ambito delle rispettive competenze".

source

And that says that a bishop is not a public official so therefore has no duty to denounce kiddie rapists. Anyone with more competent Italian, please feel free to correct me.
But they have a legal responsibility to report them to the police and stop them doing it again..
It's not even legal....it's the christian thing to do... 
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Offline The Gulleysucker

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It's interesting that they chose to move fast enough with Ettore Gotti Tedeschi ...

And in other news from the See, It's the Butler what's been doing it....
I don't do polite so fuck yoursalf with your stupid accusations...

Right you fuckwit I will show you why you are talking out of your fat arse...

Mutton Geoff (Obviously a real nice guy)

Offline Billy The Kid

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It never ceases to amaze me how 'Christians' conjure up all sorts of crazy shit in order to excuse their 'god'.

God gets all the credit for all the good things in the world doesn't he? Thank god for this and thank god for that. When all is rosy we bask in the lords greatness. But when you bring up topics such as grown men fucking children, all of a sudden you're met with typical "Christian" mentality. Maybe god made us imperfect? Maybe its just his way of testing faith? Maybe its his mysterious way? Maybe its his way of punishing us for being imperfect?

So he makes us imperfect, and then punishes us for the fact that he made us imperfect by allowing innocent kids to get it in the ass. Marvelous logic isn't it? I discuss this with my parents all the time. They both come from staunch catholic backgrounds. My Dad says stuff to me like "you need to repent son, you should go to confession son". I say stuff to him like "why should I walk into catholic church and confess my sins to a catholic priest when the entire catholic organization is one which has been proven to have knowingly covered up the raping of children?"

My Dad, bless him, comes out with literally any excuse he can think of to excuse his god. He despises those responsible for the child abuse, but he wont hear a bad word said about his god. That's what I mean by typical christian mentality. Its such utter bollox
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Offline Billy The Kid

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the holy spirit is a bird and i think it's beautiful.  it's something people shouldn't lose sight of because of the wrongs of clergymen.  all of us are sinners saved by god's grace.  there are many things in life that are wrong, we should try and resolve the things we can.

I agree, we should resolve the things we can. Perhaps we could start it by bring to knave those who raped children, as well as the bastards who covered up for said rapists. That would be a good place to start wouldn't you agree? Perhaps once we've addressed that problem we could move onto the issue of people dying in Africa due to aids. You know those poor souls? The ones who are told repeatedly by men of the cloth in the Vatican that the use of contraception should not be considered as a means for quelling the problem. Because its immoral. Just like child buggery

Do you think we could be noble enough to forget about white dove like holy spirits for just a moment in order to help those who have suffered so cruelly and unjustly at the hands of heinously corrupt bastards who claim to represent your "god" ? Because you know, its probably hard to appreciate white doves and all that jazz when you have to deal with the mental scarring of being raped as a child, or the fact that your going to die from a disease which could have been averted. You see, I'd consider those to be more pressing issues than keeping sight of imaginary birds and holy spirits and other such bollox
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A quick look at how some of the Vatican's American counterparts are dealing with the, erm....situation.

Catholic League’s Donohue vows to fight rape victims ‘one by one’

By David Ferguson
Tuesday, March 13, 2012

Bill Donohue, president of the Catholic League, believes that the Catholic church has gone too easy on the survivors of sex abuse by clergy, and has vowed to fight them “one by one,” says a post at the blog Right Wing Watch.

In an interview with Laurie Goodstein of the New York Times, Donohue says that in the past the church “has been too quick to write a check” to individuals who report being victimized by pedophile priests. He believes that the church should fight each case “one by one,” ostensibly to save money “in the long run.”

He said that Catholic bishops should “toughen up and go out and buy some good lawyers to get tough” in the fight against victims of sex abuse. “We don’t need altar boys.”

Currently Donohue is backing the efforts of lawyers defending two Missouri priests accused of multiple counts of child molestation. Attorneys for the priests have issued subpoenas to the victims’ advocacy group the Survivor Network of those Abused by Priests (SNAP), seeking “more than two decades of e-mails that could include correspondence with victims, lawyers, whistle-blowers, witnesses, the police, prosecutors and journalists,” according to the New York Times article.

SNAP is not involved in the Missouri case, but Donohue believes that the attacks are warranted because, in his words, “SNAP is a menace to the Catholic chruch.” The subpoenas, thanks to their exhaustiveness, are calculated to distract, bankrupt and embarrass the organization.

SNAP’s national director David Clohessy has been deposed in the Missouri case, but is resisting the subpoenas, saying they’re not just a fishing expedition, but a “fishing, crabbing, shrimping, trash-collecting, draining the pond expedition,” whose real mission is to “harass and discredit and bankrupt SNAP, while discouraging victims, witnesses, whistle-blowers, police, prosecutors and journalists from seeking our help.”

The Catholic League, who comedian Kathy Griffin says is “just that one guy (Donohue) and his computer” has a long history of gravitating toward headline-grabbing cases involving the Catholic church. Right Wing Watch has a post documenting the organization’s inability to stay out of the spotlight and its leader’s inability to keep his foot out of his mouth, including his public announcement of a penchant for “gook jokes,” his referring to progressive Catholics as “termites,” and saying that “secular Jews” who like “anal sex and abortions” run Hollywood.

source

Offline SP

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...

He sounds mighty like a lone nutter. There is plenty of ammunition to damn the Church's behaviour in this whole affair without invoking the lunatic fringe. He is probably best ignored.

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He sounds mighty like a lone nutter. There is plenty of ammunition to damn the Church's behaviour in this whole affair without invoking the lunatic fringe. He is probably best ignored.

He is, these guys aren't.

Quote
the efforts of lawyers defending two Missouri priests accused of multiple counts of child molestation. Attorneys for the priests have issued subpoenas to the victims’ advocacy group the Survivor Network of those Abused by Priests (SNAP), seeking “more than two decades of e-mails that could include correspondence with victims, lawyers, whistle-blowers, witnesses, the police, prosecutors and journalists,”


Offline SP

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Offline Andy @ Allerton!

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It seems these people have little to do with God. But the actions of some doesn't make everyone evil.
Quote from: tubby on Today at 12:45:53 pm

They both went in high, that's factually correct, both tried to play the ball at height.  Doku with his foot, Mac Allister with his chest.

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It seems these people have little to do with God.

They say they do. Why would they lie? Perhaps it's all part of their God's instructions.

Offline Andy @ Allerton!

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They say they do. Why would they lie? Perhaps it's all part of their God's instructions.


I wouldn't have thought so.
Quote from: tubby on Today at 12:45:53 pm

They both went in high, that's factually correct, both tried to play the ball at height.  Doku with his foot, Mac Allister with his chest.

Offline BarryCrocker

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A quick look at how some of the Vatican's American counterparts are dealing with the, erm....situation.

Catholic League’s Donohue vows to fight rape victims ‘one by one’

source

That would be the equivalent of the Nazi’s pressuring the victims of the holocaust.

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Offline Sarge

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The Holy Spirit is like a dove.

Its no real.
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Offline Sarge

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On the whole, yes.  At least, from you there is.  You're always outraged, even if Brady stands down you'll still be outraged.  On the internet - outraged.  You may have no faith in God, but have you lost faith in reconciliation?  That's why I said about the Holy Spirit and how it's a bird; as Christians historically we've put too much faith in men, we should look more to God and The Holy Spirit - a more personal faith i suppose.  My Nan grew up in an industrial school in Ireland and when i found out i lost my faith for some time, until i came to think that God may have made man imperfect, he made sorrow and he made grief, but he didn't make industrial schools.  Similarly Christ founded the Catholic Church, but he didn't create the shambles in Ireland at present or the Medicis or Alexander vi or say that The Pope was infallible, it's not God or Jesus that have lost there way, it is us.  I understand outrage, but you shouldn't let it define you.  Try and let love more positive thoughts and deeds define you... stop worrying and enjoy your life!

You see this is what is wrong with the whole thing, you can turn to 'God' who clearly does not exist and take confort in him/her/it but those who actually suffered find nothing but redtape blocking the path to justice because the biggest mafia on the planet has far to mych say in the workings of this planet, morallity is not just a religious thing ya know.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2012, 10:33:35 am by Sarge »
Y.N.W.A.

Offline Brian Blessed

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The Vatican Stories topic is locked, but I don't think this is worth a topic of it's own, so I'm shoving it in here.

American nuns come out swinging against Vatican in face of ‘radical feminist’ accusations



Down with this sort of thing



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He sounds mighty like a lone nutter.

They're the most dangerous. Jesus, Muhammed etc.
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Offline kopitecrash

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The Vatican Stories topic is locked, but I don't think this is worth a topic of it's own, so I'm shoving it in here.

American nuns come out swinging against Vatican in face of ‘radical feminist’ accusations



Down with this sort of thing

'The Vatican report said that at an annual gathering of the Leadership Conference of Women Religious, guest speakers who preached "radical feminism" went unchallenged. The report also said the nuns were too focused on social justice and not enough on opposing abortion, euthanasia and same-sex marriage.'

Oh those dastardly women!
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Offline RojoLeón

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<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/2ve1vQzuAo0?version=3&amp;amp;hl=en_US&amp;amp;rel=0" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/2ve1vQzuAo0?version=3&amp;amp;hl=en_US&amp;amp;rel=0</a>

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In the 1960s in California William Coulson and a group of radical psychotherapists were able to convince a group of nuns to become guinea pigs in a bizarre psychological experiment. The Convent of the Immaculate Heart in Los Angeles, one of the largest seminaries in America, was the place chosen. Quite why the convent approved of this experiment is beyond me but I suppose they wanted to appear hip and trendy. The nuns were going to be put in an encounter group. This is defined as “a typically unstructured psychotherapy group in which the participants seek to increase their sensitivity, responsiveness, and emotional expressiveness, as by freely verbalizing and responding to emotions”. They most certainly did that.

The convent was transformed.  This quote from one of the nuns indicated that strange things were happening:

You are trying to assert yourself, trying to find out who you are, who you are becoming, at the same time you are trying to live a life of dedication of service and you are trying to make all of these things fit into who you are, and it’s such a turmoil at times that you just blow a gasket and do silly crazy things. Running around the orchard and stealing oranges and taking Cokes out of the refrigerator, crazy things.

The nuns voted to discard their habits but that was nothing compared to what was about to happen. These sessions unleashed forces previously that had previously lain dormant – sex. Nuns started seducing each other. It may sound like a Larry Flynt production but it really happened.

Within a year 300 nuns, more than half the convent, had petitioned the Vatican to be released from their vows and six months later the convent closed its doors. All that was left was a small group of radical lesbian nuns.

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Sometimes, it's all just too much.

APNewsBreak: Vatican gets Fox media adviser

NICOLE WINFIELD and VICTOR L. SIMPSON | Associated Press –

VATICAN CITY (AP) — The Vatican has brought in the Fox News correspondent in Rome to help improve its communications strategy as it tries to cope with years of communications blunders and one of its most serious scandals in decades, officials said Saturday.

Greg Burke, 52, will leave Fox to become the senior communications adviser in the Vatican's secretariat of state, the Vatican and Burke told The Associated Press.

"I'm a bit nervous but very excited. Let's just say it's a challenge," Burke said in a phone interview.

He defined his job, which he said he had been offered twice before, as being along the lines of the White House senior communications adviser: "You're shaping the message, you're molding the message, and you're trying to make sure everyone remains on-message. And that's tough."

Burke, a native of St. Louis, Missouri, is a member of the conservative Opus Dei movement. Pope John Paul II's longtime spokesman, Joaquin Navarro-Valls, was also a member of Opus Dei and was known for the papal access he enjoyed and his ability to craft the messages John Paul wanted to get out.

After Pope Benedict XVI was elected in 2005, Navarro-Valls was replaced by the Rev. Federico Lombardi, a Jesuit who had long headed Vatican Radio and still does, along with running the Vatican press office and Vatican television service.

Lombardi told the AP that Burke will help integrate communications issues within the Vatican's top administrative office, the secretariat of state, and will help handle its relations with the Holy See press office and other Vatican communications offices. Burke will report to the Vatican undersecretary of state and the official who oversees Vatican communications in the secretariat.

Lombardi confirmed the news after the AP broke the story, several days before the Holy See had planned to announce it officially.

The Vatican has been bedeviled by communications blunders ever since Benedict's 2005 election, and is currently dealing with a scandal over Vatican documents that were leaked to Italian journalists. While the scandal is serious — Benedict himself convened a special meeting of cardinals Saturday to try to cope with it — the Vatican's communications problems long predate it.

Benedict's now-infamous speech about Muslims and violence, his 2009 decision to rehabilitate a schismatic bishop who denied the Holocaust, and the Vatican's response to the 2010 explosion of the sex abuse scandal are just a few of the blunders that have tarnished Benedict's papacy.

Even the Vatican's response to the leaks from within the Vatican of sensitive papal documents hasn't involved a terribly sophisticated public relations strategy. Just last week the Vatican No. 2, Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, blamed the media and the devil for fueling the scandal and accused journalists of "pretending to be Dan Brown."

Brown wrote "The Da Vinci Code," the best-selling fictional account that portrayed Opus Dei — of which Bertone's new communications adviser is a member — as being at the root of an international Catholic conspiracy.

Burke acknowledged the difficult task ahead but said that after turning down the Vatican twice before, he went with his gut and accepted the third time around. "This is an opportunity and challenge that I'm not going to get again," he said.

He said he didn't know what, if any, role his membership in Opus Dei played. Opus is greatly in favor in the Vatican these days, particularly as other new religious movements such as the Legion of Christ have lost credibility with their own problems. Currently, for example, the cardinal who is heading the Vatican's internal investigation into the leaks of documents is the Opus Dei prelate, Cardinal Julian Herranz.

"I'm an old-fashioned Midwestern Catholic whose mother went to Mass every day," Burke said. "Am I being hired because I'm in Opus Dei?" he asked. "It might come into play." But he noted he was also in Opus when he was hired by Fox and Time magazine.

Burke has been a Fox correspondent since he joined the U.S. network in 2001. He was the Time magazine correspondent in Rome for a decade before that.

At Fox, he led the network's coverage of the death of John Paul and election of Benedict in 2005, and has covered the papacy since then, traveling with the pope around the globe. But he has also used Rome as a base for non-Vatican reporting, including several stints in the Middle East during the last intifada, labor law protests in France and the terrorist attacks in London and Madrid.

He is a graduate of Columbia University's School of Journalism.

source

Offline Brian Blessed

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I don't know when your birthday is, corky, but consider this an early present.

http://www.theage.com.au/world/priest-guilty-of-hiding-abuse-20120623-20uxg.html

Offline ♠Dirty Harry♠

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On the whole, yes.  At least, from you there is.  You're always outraged, even if Brady stands down you'll still be outraged.  On the internet - outraged.  You may have no faith in God, but have you lost faith in reconciliation?  That's why I said about the Holy Spirit and how it's a bird; as Christians historically we've put too much faith in men, we should look more to God and The Holy Spirit - a more personal faith i suppose.  My Nan grew up in an industrial school in Ireland and when i found out i lost my faith for some time, until i came to think that God may have made man imperfect, he made sorrow and he made grief, but he didn't make industrial schools.  Similarly Christ founded the Catholic Church, but he didn't create the shambles in Ireland at present or the Medicis or Alexander vi or say that The Pope was infallible, it's not God or Jesus that have lost there way, it is us.  I understand outrage, but you shouldn't let it define you.  Try and let love more positive thoughts and deeds define you... stop worrying and enjoy your life!

The Holy Spirit is like a dove.

Don't know how I missed this. It's like someone reading Lord of the Rings out loud and trying to convince us Hobbits are real, fuck me just read it back to yourself and tell me it doesn't sound absolutely preposterous and embarrassing.

Sometimes I think religious folk should be sectioned, either that or you are a world class fisherman and I doff my cap to you.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2012, 09:35:08 am by ♠Dirty Harry♠ »

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Sometimes I think religious folk should be sectioned, either that or you are a world class fisherman and I doff my cap to you.
Mark 1:17 ;)

Offline ♠Dirty Harry♠

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I don't know when your birthday is, corky, but consider this an early present.

http://www.theage.com.au/world/priest-guilty-of-hiding-abuse-20120623-20uxg.html

About time, well done Oz.

Wow, Sandusky too.

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And where Australia forges, Britain follows...


Catholic Church loses child sex abuse liability appeal

12 July 2012

A ruling that the Catholic Church can be held liable for the wrongdoings of its priests has been upheld.

Last year Mr Justice MacDuff decided in favour of a woman, now 47, who claimed she was raped and assaulted as a child by a priest of the Portsmouth Diocese.

The Court of Appeal has upheld this decision, which raises "an issue of wide general importance in respect of claims against the Catholic Church".

A diocese spokesman said the case was about "fundamental legal principles".

'Religious freedom'

The woman, who cannot be named for legal reasons, says she was assaulted as a child by the late Father William Baldwin, a priest of the Portsmouth Diocese, at a children's home in Hampshire run by an order of nuns.

Lawyers for the claimant said of the ruling in November 2011 that it was the first time a court had been asked to rule on whether the "relationship between a Catholic priest and his bishop is akin to an employment relationship".

After the latest hearing, the claimant's lawyer Tracey Emmott said: 'It is hoped that this ruling will now be accepted, and that victims of abuse by Catholic priests can be treated with the dignity and respect they deserve."

A spokesman for the diocese said: "This case is not, and has never been, about seeking to avoid or delay the payment of compensation to victims with valid claims.

"This case is about fundamental legal principles involving the very nature of civil society and religious freedom.

"It would be disastrous if, in seeking to provide redress for victims of harm, the law put intolerable new pressures on the voluntary sector.

"This judgement shows further thought and scrutiny are required before clarity in this regard can be established."

'Reliving nightmares'

The Court of Appeal judgement said the diocese could not appeal against the decision until a similar case at the Supreme Court on 23 July had been concluded.

Speaking after the original ruling last year, the alleged victim said: "I relive it in my nightmares. It doesn't go just because I'm not in a court room - because I know that when I go to sleep it will be there.

"Being six and never being in a home, I didn't understand that that [the abuse] wasn't OK.

"Because I'd never been around priests, I had no idea that that wasn't OK."

source

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Pa. monsignor gets 3-6 years in sex abuse cover-up

sentenced Tuesday to three to six years in prison by a judge who said he "enabled monsters in clerical garb ... to destroy the souls of children."

This is a quote from his lawyer - "He did the best he could under absolute awful circumstances,"

He didn't quite do as much as he could, did he?

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'The Vatican report said that at an annual gathering of the Leadership Conference of Women Religious, guest speakers who preached "radical feminism" went unchallenged. The report also said the nuns were too focused on social justice and not enough on opposing abortion, euthanasia and same-sex marriage.'

Oh those dastardly women!

Mitt Romney loves this.
Been all over the world but Anfield is still my home.

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Pa. monsignor gets 3-6 years in sex abuse cover-up

sentenced Tuesday to three to six years in prison by a judge who said he "enabled monsters in clerical garb ... to destroy the souls of children."

This is a quote from his lawyer - "He did the best he could under absolute awful circumstances,"

He didn't quite do as much as he could, did he?

Still awesome to see people getting jailed for the cover up.

Offline Brian Blessed

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First one in the US. Although I assume his boss should follow, assuming he still lives.

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Re: Vatican letter told Ireland's Catholic bishops not to report child abuse
« Reply #155 on: August 22, 2012, 02:37:55 pm »
However....


Vatican win: Judge says priests aren't employees

NIGEL DUARA, Associated Press
 August 20, 2012

PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) — The Vatican won a major victory Monday in an Oregon federal courtroom, where a judge ruled that the Holy See is not the employer of molester priests.

The decision by U.S. District Court Judge Michael Mosman ends a six-year question in the decade-old case and could shield the Vatican from possible monetary damages.

The original lawsuit was filed in 2002 by a Seattle-area man who said the Rev. Andrew Ronan repeatedly molested him in the late 1960s.

The plaintiff tried to show that Ronan and all priests are employees of the Vatican, which is therefore liable for their actions.

source



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Re: Vatican letter told Ireland's Catholic bishops not to report child abuse
« Reply #156 on: August 22, 2012, 03:06:08 pm »
Are priests self-employed then?

I thought they payed taxes as employees.

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Re: Vatican letter told Ireland's Catholic bishops not to report child abuse
« Reply #157 on: August 22, 2012, 03:30:36 pm »
Are priests self-employed then?

I thought they payed taxes as employees.
Yeah. I assumed they got a W2 each January. Maybe they file as self-employed.

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Re: Vatican letter told Ireland's Catholic bishops not to report child abuse
« Reply #158 on: August 30, 2012, 11:33:12 am »
Father Benedict Groeschel, American Friar, Claims Teens Seduce Priests In Some Sex Abuse Cases

In a recent interview with the National Catholic Register, Father Benedict Groeschel, of the conservative Franciscan Friars of the Renewal, said that teens act as seducers in some sexual abuse cases involving priests.

It's been close to decade since an investigation into clergy sex abuse cases by The Boston Globe unearthed a shocking scandal and cover-up that rocked the foundations of the Catholic Church in the U.S. and around the world.

Ten years may have passed, but the wounds have yet to fully heal in America, especially in light of the recent Penn State allegations, as well as the trial of Monsignor William Lynn, former secretary for the clergy in the Archdiocese of Philadelphia.

In light of this, the recent comments by Groeschel seem both puzzling and jarringly out of step with current sentiments.

In an interview with the National Catholic Register posted this week, Groeschel was asked about his work with the very conservative Friars of the Renewal, a breakaway order he founded 25 years ago. The conversation took an interesting turn, however, when the editor asked about the 78-year-old's work with sexual abuse perpetrators.

"People have this picture in their minds of a person planning to — a psychopath," Groeschel said. "But that’s not the case. Suppose you have a man having a nervous breakdown, and a youngster comes after him. A lot of the cases, the youngster — 14, 16, 18 — is the seducer."

Pressed for clarification, the New York State-based religious leader explained that kids looking for father figures might be drawn to priests to fill a hole.

Furthermore, Groeschel expressed a belief that most of these "relationships" are heterosexual in nature, and that historically sexual relationships between men and boys have not been thought of as crimes.

"If you go back 10 or 15 years ago with different sexual difficulties — except for rape or violence — it was very rarely brought as a civil crime. Nobody thought of it that way... And I’m inclined to think, on [a priest's] first offense, they should not go to jail because their intention was not committing a crime."

The fact that the interview was published, without comment, in the National Catholic Register was significant due to the publication's affiliation with disgraced Legion of Christ religious order.

In 1995 the legion was part of a group of investors who saved the National Catholic Register from closing. The powerful clerical order was also part of one of the most damaging scandals, involving its one-time leader, the Rev. Marcial Maciel, the highest-profile Catholic clergyman ever to be accused of sexual abuse, according to Time magazine.

In 2005, the Vatican scrambled to try to minimize the damage done by revelations that the extremely influential Mexican priest had been abusing seminarians for year.

Groeschel is an influential voice in the American Dioceses and continues to maintain a high-profile in the church, writing several books and appearing weekly on a religious television network.

The priest received a doctorate in psychology from Columbia University in 1971 and now lives in Larchment, N.Y., where he assists with Trinity Retreat, a center for prayer and study for the clergy he founded.

Trinity House stirred controversy in 2006 when the press learned that New York priests credibly accused of sexually abusing children, but not legally convicted, had the option of a life-long close supervision program that began with a stay at the retreat. In the wake of community objections, the Archdiocese later removed Trinity House from the list of program's offered facilities, according to the Larchmont Gazette.

Groeschel is also a professor of pastoral psychology at St. Joseph’s Seminary of the Archdiocese of New York.

source

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Re: Vatican letter told Ireland's Catholic bishops not to report child abuse
« Reply #159 on: August 30, 2012, 11:47:05 am »
"If you go back 10 or 15 years ago with different sexual difficulties — except for rape or violence — it was very rarely brought as a civil crime. Nobody thought of it that way.

The whole thing is amazing, but this is especially weird. What's he saying? That paedophilia used to be more acceptable in the old days? That it took judges and law courts to make it immoral?

These Catholic fundamentalists have nothing but contempt for the civil law in most instances. They prefer look to the Bible for their moral guidance and would love to base laws on scripture if they could. But this twat is saying that until the law got involved in paedophilia cases the priests were clueless about what was 'right' and what was 'wrong'.

They - and their church - are obsolete. 
"If you want the world to love you don't discuss Middle Eastern politics" Saul Bellow.