Topic: Steven George Gerrard of Liverpool and no longer England

[decky]

By his reaction it looked more like a twinge. He's experienced enough to know that it would've been unwise to continue given the schedule we have coming up

[Sakho_lfc]

Hopefully he is not out for long. His set piece is as good as it gets this year.

However it is not the worst thing in the world if he miss the Spurs game. I think Gerrard is crucial especially in home games where the opposite team sits back and defend. In away games though, I think having more energetic midfielders might actually be better.

Against Spurs, having henderson, allen and lucas in the midfield center might help us press better. 

[Fromola]

Different players decline at different rates, Nolan is two younger than Gerrard but looked completely shot to pieces today.

Nolan doesn't look after himself. He's always on the bevy. Gerrard is a model pro off the pitch.

[sinnermichael]

Sounds like 2-3 weeks. Hopefully he'll be back for City on Boxing Day.

[carling]

From Rodgers.

“You need to analyse the people and what age he is at and the body type he is,” explained Rodgers.

“One of the biggest things in our method of work is the recovery method. Stevie for example plays on the Saturday, recovers on the Sunday doing pulls, stretch and massage, on the Tuesday recovers further with maybe a light jog. It’s a long load of low intensity recovery. Stevie was fit enough to play Saturday, Tuesday and Sunday at the start of this season.

“He has moderate to low intensity recovery programmes. We have individual plans for every player in terms of getting them through the games.”

Rodgers has also said that he is more than happy to give Gerrard extra days off when he he feels it’s fit to, because he knows he will be doing everything in a correct manner to ensure he is ready for the next fixture.

“It depends if you are a dogmatic coach and you think you always have to have the player out there,” said Rodgers.

“Given the culture we have created here, the players want to be out training every day.

“Sometimes with the recovery, they’ll feel they want to do a bit more. But the numbers have shown since we have come here that the methodology of our work physically, technically and tactically helps them on game day.

“They have bought into that and it’s something they enjoy. As a manager it’s your job to orchestrate and oversee that, that’s why when I came in here I needed to bring my own people in as they know exactly what I think in terms of the whole holistic approach to the players.”

Urghh. Where was this when we had to read through pages and pages of bile saying Stevie should be rested more.

[Ronnie1932]

Reckon it will be a.month, be interesting to see how we cope.

[lorenzo23]

Where is this 2-3 weeks/Month coming from? Also i think its about time other players showed some character and stepped up i guess.

[KiNki]

we could really do with a cold weather snap.

[Felch Aid]

Who's taking the penno's whilst he's out?

[Cochise]

Who's taking the penno's whilst he's out?

Mignolet

[Number 7]

Injuries beginning to pile up,  and they are key players like Enrique, Sturridge and Gerrard.

Losing Gerrard would be a massive blow, but someone will just need to step up. It was interesting yesterday though, because usually Gerrard sets the tempo for us and initiates a lot of our attacks. But it was Allen that was doing that yesterday,  so I think we'll manage without him fine. Still, we'll miss the other stuff like set piece delivery, and defense splitting balls.

[Pistolero]

did you see the cocky's hut on Nolan?...i think the c*nt's got shares in the Lobster Pot

[Caligula?]

He's a massive loss, and I don't think either Lucas or Allen can replace what we lose in him. Huge blow if he's out for more than the Spurs game.

[PhaseOfPlay]

He's a massive loss, and I don't think either Lucas or Allen can replace what we lose in him. Huge blow if he's out for more than the Spurs game.

What do we lose?

[PhaseOfPlay]

Injuries beginning to pile up,  and they are key players like Enrique, Sturridge and Gerrard.

Losing Gerrard would be a massive blow, but someone will just need to step up. It was interesting yesterday though, because usually Gerrard sets the tempo for us and initiates a lot of our attacks. But it was Allen that was doing that yesterday,  so I think we'll manage without him fine. Still, we'll miss the other stuff like set piece delivery, and defense splitting balls.

I don't think they're "beginning to pile up". We have three first team players injured. Only Enrique is long-term though (for now)

[Semi Skimmed]

What do we lose?

Aye, it's a definite plus for us.


Jesus Christ!

[PhaseOfPlay]

Aye, it's a definite plus for us.


Jesus Christ!

Learn to read.

I didn't say "it's a plus"

I asked "What do we lose?"

Do you want to attempt to answer the question?

[Caligula?]

What do we lose?

He is one of the best, if not the best set piece takers in the league. I can't be arsed to go through the stats, but know without even looking that he's directly set up either Suarez or Sturridge a number of times this season with his fantastic set piece delivery. Not to mention his ability to pick out a long pass, an ability that neither Allen nor Lucas seem to possess. His pass to Sturridge for our second goal against Sunderland springs to mind.

That's what we lose, and it's a massive loss.

[Paragon]

What do we lose?

Our best chance of a goal from midfield, for one...

His injury is a blow ahead of some big away games coming up this month. Hope he's back fit soon.

[PhaseOfPlay]

He is one of the best, if not the best set piece takers in the league. I can't be arsed to go through the stats, but know without even looking that he's directly set up either Suarez or Sturridge a number of times this season with his fantastic set piece delivery. Not to mention his ability to pick out a long pass, an ability that neither Allen nor Lucas seem to possess. His pass to Sturridge for our second goal against Sunderland springs to mind.

That's what we lose, and it's a massive loss.

We don't know what other players set-piece delivery is like, though, because nobody else takes set-pieces. So while his set pieces are a loss, we don't know yet how we will be affected.

Secondly, Allen plays plenty of long passes. Check the "stats" out and you'll see. But losing long passes is not a huge deal - it's not like we're a long-ball team and we've lost our main outlet. We're a passing team, and we have Allen to connect the lines.

Thirdly, we gain more defensive balance in midfield, because we will have three players capable of getting up and down the field for 90 minutes.

In other words, what we lose is offset by what we gain, and what we lose is an unknown variable until we see the quality of delivery that other players might have.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Our best chance of a goal from midfield, for one...

His injury is a blow ahead of some big away games coming up this month. Hope he's back fit soon.

How many goals has Gerrard scored from midfield in open play?

[rocco]

What do we lose?

Assists

Can be a Game changer

[Juan Loco]

What do we lose?

Our best creator and that unquantifiable 'chemical X' (hi fans of the powerpuff girls) that none of our other midfielders really have bar Coutinho. Allen, Henderson, Lucas - with the greatest will in the world, can't swing in a ball from 40 yards in the dying embers of a game and give one of our players a glorious chance. Gerrard might.

I think we may have a greater chance of dogging it out in midfield now (though Lucas is hardly Johnny Mobility in there), but it's further onus on Suarez to be the one that can offer something unexpected and game changing.

[Draex]

I've seen this chap called Suarez do alright with a free kick or two.

[Caligula?]

We don't know what other players set-piece delivery is like, though, because nobody else takes set-pieces. So while his set pieces are a loss, we don't know yet how we will be affected.

Secondly, Allen plays plenty of long passes. Check the "stats" out and you'll see. But losing long passes is not a huge deal - it's not like we're a long-ball team and we've lost our main outlet. We're a passing team, and we have Allen to connect the lines.

Thirdly, we gain more defensive balance in midfield, because we will have three players capable of getting up and down the field for 90 minutes.

In other words, what we lose is offset by what we gain, and what we lose is an unknown variable until we see the quality of delivery that other players might have.

So you're saying that losing the player who has created the most chances for his team mates this season is offset by what we gain from, erm, players more capable of getting up and down the field for 90 minutes? And you talk about what we lose as an "unkown varible" but are 100% confident in what we're supposedly going to gain without having seen it yet? 

[Juan Loco]

I've seen this chap called Suarez do alright with a free kick or two.

He's also usually the one scoring from those crossed freekicks into the box. I don't even think Suarez can put the ball into the box and get in it to head it home.

[Paragon]

How many goals has Gerrard scored from midfield in open play?

This season? None of his three goals have come from open play. Surely you can't use that statistic as a means of denying he's our best chance of a goal from midfield though? Steven Gerrard has been our best chance of a goal from midfield for years. In fact before the arrival of Torres we all bemoaned the fact that we didn't have a striker who could outscore him.

[Gerrard[LFC]]

How many goals has Gerrard scored from midfield in open play?

How many goals has our other starting midfielders all combined scored from open play?
think it was 0 until last week when Sterling scored. Sterling wasn't a starter until Sturridge got injured.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Assists

WE are missing his set-piece delivery, for sure.

But people are missing the question, because I didn't expand on it.

The real question is "What do we lose, and is it replaceable?"

The answer to assists is complicated, because most of Gerrard's assists are from corners and free kicks. He also takes most of the corners and indirect free kicks. So we won't know what impact his absence will have, until someone else takes the corners and free kicks.

His non-set-piece assists, though, are on a par with the rest of the team. We have 12 players who have assisted a goal for a total of 20 assists. Gerrard has 6 of those, of which 4 were set piece/corners. So for open play assists, he has 2 - the same number as Sturridge, Suarez and Enrique. So again, we're not in the crippled position some people like to think. We don't know how the next set-piece taker will perform, and they could perform equally well. Similarly, it's not like we're reliant on Gerrard for assists from open play. Suarez creates them, Coutinho creates them, Johnson creates them, Henderson creates them, Sterling creates them. It's a loss, but not a crippling one.

So the main question, as I said, is really "Are we actually losing much, or are we able to replace what Gerrard brings?"

And I think we've enough in the squad to replace most of what Gerrard brings to the team, if we spread it around the other players.

[PhaseOfPlay]

How many goals has our other starting midfielders all combined scored from open play?
think it was 0 until last week when Sterling scored. Sterling wasn't a starter until Sturridge got injured.

3. Moses, Sterling, Coutinho.

[PhaseOfPlay]

This season? None of his three goals have come from open play. Surely you can't use that statistic as a means of denying he's our best chance of a goal from midfield though? Steven Gerrard has been our best chance of a goal from midfield for years. In fact before the arrival of Torres we all bemoaned the fact that we didn't have a striker who could outscore him.

Coutinho gets twice the amount of shots per game this season - in less games - than Gerrard. He is our best chance of a goal from midfield in open play. What Gerrard did 4 years ago has no bearing on what he has done this season.

[PhaseOfPlay]

So you're saying that losing the player who has created the most chances for his team mates this season is offset by what we gain from, erm, players more capable of getting up and down the field for 90 minutes? And you talk about what we lose as an "unkown varible" but are 100% confident in what we're supposedly going to gain without having seen it yet?

I'm saying we don't know what the set-piece situation will be like until we see someone else take them, and we don't lose anything that's replaceable by Coutinho or Suarez in open play. In other words, people need to calm themselves down and cop the hell on to the fact that we are a TEAM, with many ways to hurt the opposition, as well as having the best forward in the league up front.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Our best creator and that unquantifiable 'chemical X' (hi fans of the powerpuff girls) that none of our other midfielders really have bar Coutinho. Allen, Henderson, Lucas - with the greatest will in the world, can't swing in a ball from 40 yards in the dying embers of a game and give one of our players a glorious chance. Gerrard might.

I think we may have a greater chance of dogging it out in midfield now (though Lucas is hardly Johnny Mobility in there), but it's further onus on Suarez to be the one that can offer something unexpected and game changing.

We don't know for sure, though Juan. Gerrard has dominated the free kicks and corners. But if I remember correctly, Coutinho sent the corner in for Suarez's second against Norwich, did he not? So maybe Coutinho will fill the gap left by what Gerrard brings to the table?

[Gerrard[LFC]]

3. Moses, Sterling, Coutinho.

Moses and Sterling has been our poorest player this season.
Sterling has improved and is looking better.
 
Coutinho's goal was from set piece.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Moses and Sterling has been our poorest player this season.
Sterling has improved and is looking better.
 
Coutinho's goal was from set piece.

That's not the point that was made.

[ElstonGunn]

This season? None of his three goals have come from open play. Surely you can't use that statistic as a means of denying he's our best chance of a goal from midfield though? Steven Gerrard has been our best chance of a goal from midfield for years. In fact before the arrival of Torres we all bemoaned the fact that we didn't have a striker who could outscore him.

Coutinho has a much better chance of scoring a goal, in large part because he takes many times as many shots as Gerrard. Fair enough if you were talking about deep midfield.

[rocco]

WE are missing his set-piece delivery, for sure.

But people are missing the question, because I didn't expand on it.

The real question is "What do we lose, and is it replaceable?"

The answer to assists is complicated, because most of Gerrard's assists are from corners and free kicks. He also takes most of the corners and indirect free kicks. So we won't know what impact his absence will have, until someone else takes the corners and free kicks.

His non-set-piece assists, though, are on a par with the rest of the team. We have 12 players who have assisted a goal for a total of 20 assists. Gerrard has 6 of those, of which 4 were set piece/corners. So for open play assists, he has 2 - the same number as Sturridge, Suarez and Enrique. So again, we're not in the crippled position some people like to think. We don't know how the next set-piece taker will perform, and they could perform equally well. Similarly, it's not like we're reliant on Gerrard for assists from open play. Suarez creates them, Coutinho creates them, Johnson creates them, Henderson creates them, Sterling creates them. It's a loss, but not a crippling one.

So the main question, as I said, is really "Are we actually losing much, or are we able to replace what Gerrard brings?"

And I think we've enough in the squad to replace most of what Gerrard brings to the team, if we spread it around the other players.

Suppose we won't know until he does miss  few games  , who knows the team might surprise us ?

Was surprised Rodgers didn't rest him at HT v Norwich

[Gerrard[LFC]]

That's not the point that was made.

  so the point is no Midfielders who normally starts has scored from open play.

[Kashinoda]

@BalesofHay

We will miss his range of passing, which stretches teams out and creates space for our attackers to work. You can use statistics to point to direct assists but what about the 50 yard cross field passes that are knocked on for others to score? Two examples off the top of my head are his one to Henderson to set up Suarez a few weeks ago and a huge one to Sturridge to set Suarez up for a tap in a month or so ago. I'm sure there are more examples of this.

[Halcyon Lissome]

Coutinho gets twice the amount of shots per game this season - in less games - than Gerrard. He is our best chance of a goal from midfield in open play. What Gerrard did 4 years ago has no bearing on what he has done this season.

I agree with you in general that most of what Gerrard does can be handled by a few players; but the discussion about Coutinho, Moses and Sterling scoring goals in open play is disingenuous. They're basically wide-forwards and/or play much further up the pitch. The fact that they've only scored 3 open goals among them is ironically not a reason to be confident they'll succeed even more in his absence. If we ever played Gerrard as consistently forward as them he'd have already out-done them. The fact that he doesn't play that position anymore shouldn't demean the point the others bring in that if we need a goal, and we are pushing forward, he is far more likely to score than our midfielders (Henderson, Allen and Lucas) to contribute.

The real thing we might miss with Gerrard is that confidence and leadership, as well as his incredible chance creation (open play or set-piece). I think the onus will be that much more on Coutinho and Suarez to do something with him out. They're capable, but it'll just take one of them having an off game for us to look very predictable.

Allen has the ability to fashion chances - not to the same quality or quantity as Gerrard - and he can help them out with covering Gerrard's share of chances created. He can certainly help us keep the ball, although I think the pace of our play will slow down because Allen doesn't really go for those cross-field switches. It might be good, it might be bad, who knows.

Generally, we'll miss him because our main strength IMO is overloading the opposition with dangerous players capable of creating chances both short (Coutinho, Sturridge, Suarez) and long (Coutinho, Gerrard).

I'm just glad we have Lucas next to Allen though. He'll allow Allen, who is just finding his feet again, to have a much easier time of it.