Author Topic: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC  (Read 15601 times)

Offline Hinesy

  • RAWK Editor. Giving it BAFTA’s. 57'sy. Caramel log dealer and comma chameleon. Tory Totty Tonguer
  • RAWK Staff.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 20,311
RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« on: April 20, 2014, 02:17:22 pm »
We go again.
Nerves? Perceived lack of outlet with no Daniel? Unusual line up? (I'm still not entirely sure how we did line up. 2-1-4-2? Wiser tacticians will enlighten us). Whatever way, that was the game we feared it might be. Once again we were one team in the first half and a very different one in the second. I thought the fact we hadn't won the league would actually lift the weight off us, no worry about how to play, just keep on heading that way to their goal and we'll be ok. But Norwich were fighting for their survival and we let them. We let them come onto us and we sat back and we didn't press as I've seen us press. Yet...
So without Henderson, Johnson wasn't sure where to pass instinctively and got us caught a few times. Without Sturridge, the opponents defence would concentrate on Suarez and let Sterling run from deeper without real initial concern. But it was that running that got us the goals...
How would you line us up now? For Chelsea? Meantime we won, not that you'd think it from a lot of people, and we took a massive 3 points from Norwich which means they'll have to try harder. Against Chelsea for example. Come on.

3 games left. The nerves are building. We go again.
Yep.

Offline thegoodfella

  • makes reindeer pizza
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 16,421
  • ...siempre es posible
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2014, 04:08:21 pm »
Must say that I thought Norwich were excellent after 0-2 and even at 1-3. Most teams would give up and concede more goals but they were great at giving us a game and trying to capitalize on the space we were offering on the wings. If it weren't for Chris Hughton, they would be doing a lot better.

Also Skrtel was amazing winning every header for a good 10 minutes in the second half. Others would say Chelsea or City have better defenders or defensive records but they are well protected by the playing style, especially Chelsea who play with a permanent handbrake and multiple bodies in front of central two.

Upwards and onwards!

Online Corkboy

  • Sworn enemy of Bottlegirl. The Boston Toilet Mangler. Grauniad of the Cidatel. Into kinky S&M with the Lash.
  • RAWK Scribe
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 32,382
  • Is it getting better?
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2014, 08:56:38 pm »
Menu du Jour

Liverpool FC 2014


Title Run In

~~~~~~

Lightning quick starters with a drizzle of goals

~~~~~~

Antipasta of flowing brilliance, with an accompaniment of harrying and pressing

~~~~~~

Sorbet

~~~~~~

Alarming slices of letting them back in it, in a "what the fuck is going on at the back" jus

~~~~~~

Meringue of more goal, with dollop of freshly whipped luck

~~~~~~

Coffee like jitters and sweaty palms


Management take no responsibility for heart failure and/or soiled underwear.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 12:29:16 am by Corkboy »

Offline E2K

  • A seriously talented
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,604
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2014, 11:29:52 pm »
I understand that people click into the ‘Round Table’ thread for posts which take a more measured, analytical approach to the game that’s just gone but, if I’m being honest, that’s not me tonight ladies and gents (maybe it never is, to be fair). So scroll down if you want any of that. Let’s face it, the performance today could have been better both individually and as a team, and anyone who says as much is entitled to do so. Me, I’ve got no interest in it. I don’t have the stomach for any of that right now, picking over the bones of a victory that brings us three games away from something I still can’t even imagine like we’re at a fucking funeral or something. All the best to anyone who wants to do that, like, but no, not me. Not tonight. No, tonight I just feel like being belligerent in my love, respect and admiration for this team because they deserve it, and I simply can’t be arsed with anything other than singing its praises as loudly as I can.

All I really cared about at roughly 1.50 p.m. today was that Liverpool Football Club had picked up another three points in this relentless march towards history, that’s it. Today’s game didn’t mean anything to me beyond that, beyond another ‘W’ to add to this jaw-dropping, perhaps era-defining collection, its significance nothing more than a snapshot in time, one piece of something far greater in magnitude than a 3-2 win at Norwich City could ever be in and of itself. In the moment, of course, it meant everything. The last 15/20 today were pure, malevolent torture and as the minutes ticked slowly by, second by excruciating second, it felt like time was going backwards. This was as important as any other game on this beautiful ride and then some, be it Arsenal, Fulham, Swansea, Southampton, Manchester United, Cardiff, Sunderland, Tottenham, West Ham or Manchester City, some of which saw much better football played and far more impressive scorelines amassed. But then the moment passed and the result was absorbed once again, beamed up into the mothership just like the other 10 or 34, a part of something infinitely more important than fleeting issues surrounding the performances of Lucas, Johnson or Mignolet, the shape of the team or how much we missed Henderson. All footnotes, friends, footnotes to history.

One team faced another today, with different prizes at stake of monumental importance, and they crashed into one other at full pelt. Liverpool shipped a few blows, no doubt about it. Norwich drew blood, then they drew it again. Were any of us expecting an easy day at the office? Truly? Were any of us expecting a stroll, maybe another 5-0 to match the Spurs game back in December in which 10 of that starting 11 took the field? Well we shouldn’t have, especially after what Sunderland (statistically still the division’s worst team) have done to ourselves and our title rivals in recent weeks. This was a battle. I said it before the game and I’ll say it again, pure desire straight from the gut, straight from the soul, straight from somewhere they don’t tell you about on Sky Super Sunday or on Match of the Day is what teams like Norwich City used to wield over Liverpool for so long, for virtually my entire lifetime supporting this wonderful club. It was the only weapon they had to level the playing field against the Fowlers and Owens, the Gerrards and Torres’, the Bergers and McManamans. We had the ability, they had the balls. Too often games were played out like nothing more than fistfights for survival in the dirt and Liverpool fucking hated that, always, for as long as I’ve known Liverpool teams, they hated it, couldn’t respond. And let’s not be arrogant here, the process of scraping out results in games like that is not beneath champions, it's the mark of champions. How many times did Liverpool teams of yesteryear win games like that? How often did Ferguson’s Manchester United? How many times was the mantra proven by championship-winning teams that if you want to play football we’ll play football, and if you want to scrap we’ll knock you out?

That’s the most important thing to take away from today. Norwich wanted to fight, not in the literal sense obviously but in the metaphorical one. Their approach was to run and tackle and hit us with every last ounce of physical effort they had in their bodies and make it so that if they lost, it wouldn’t have been for want of desire. They did that, and they did it superbly. They went down swinging with everything they had, but they went down all the same. Norwich don’t have the ability but they’ve got the fight and it would have been enough against plenty of Liverpool teams over the past 24 years. Not today. Pure ability gave Liverpool three goals via the burgeoning, potentially world-class talent that is Raheem Sterling (his shot for the first, his cross for the second, his run for the third), but it was pure effort and animal hunger on our part which saw us over the line. Don’t underestimate it, don’t undervalue it, cherish it. It means everything because this game, at its core, is still about the human confrontation, 11 vs. 11. Liverpool earned that result today, and now it’s done, in the history books, part of something greater.

Those worried that a similar performance will spell doom next week or against the suddenly (supposedly) titanic Crystal Palace the week after are underestimating the sheer will-to-win of this team and the effect that has on opponents. They're also forgetting that the Rodgers era has been defined thus far by the minor detail, the adjustment, the fine margin, the manager able to squeeze every last iota of effort, ability, performance and, ultimately, end result out of what he’s got at his disposal. A performance like we saw today, where Norwich were able to exert a degree of control over key areas of the game, may happen again and it may not. Maybe Chelsea next week will be completely different, maybe it won’t, but honestly, has Brendan Rodgers given any of us reason to doubt him yet? Has he given us any indication that he won’t know how to approach these last three games, that he won’t know how to mitigate the loss of Henderson to a sufficient extent, that he won’t have his team ready? Has he fuck. WWWWWWWWWWW…

Here we are, a team in its infancy which has moved through its evolution at the speed of light and, sometimes, isn’t fully comfortable in its own skin. Some of these players will move on, others will come in and the evolution will continue. But that’s for next year and beyond, and I genuinely have no idea why anyone would want to think about that now. Three games to history, to something we’ve awaited for so long, just three. Why look too far into the future when the present is so fucking beautiful?
« Last Edit: April 20, 2014, 11:34:38 pm by E2K »
Twitter: @e2klassic
Blog: theredstar.home.blog

royhendo

  • Guest
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2014, 11:03:02 am »
When that second goal went in, it was a blissful feeling, and a thought bubbled up in my mind saying, "My God we are so good at football". Two beautiful goals. By that point it could have been what? Four? Sterling really is starting to look like the player he was in the reserves, only he's doing it to senior pros now. Balance, poise, power, and now the end product. It's possible we're going to have a reincarnated Barnes in our side. A gilted garnish to Corkboy's already mouthwatering menu.

I watched this one on my own in a pub in Perth, and what struck me in the absence of my mate and lucky charm this week was the neutral view. A table of lads to my right who stood to win a few hundred quid if it ended 4-1, laughing in delight at Suarez and Sterling, and willing the side to win and to play football. That's an interesting thing to eavesdrop on. Of course, we shouldn't care what others think, but Rodgers is putting a side together that's winning over the neutral.

Credit to Norwich. We're gnarly though, and as Eoin says above, we should revel in that. It's part and parcel of what makes us the best team in the country and we deserve to win this league. And what's more, the neutrals want us to do it. 

Offline Yorkykopite

  • Misses Danny Boy with a passion. Phil's Official Biographer, dontcherknow...it's all true. Honestly.
  • RAWK Writer
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 34,484
  • The first five yards........
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2014, 01:59:30 pm »
That second goal was 'made in Liverpool'. It had our kitemark on it. What I especially loved about it was Raheem Sterling's poise. Once he got to the flank his head never went down to the ball. It was a beautiful piece of centre-forward's running by Suarez. The surge to the near post then the sharp change of direction away from the defender. Most wingers would have missed it because they'd have been looking down. Sterling however saw everything and was able to adjust his own cross accordingly. Pure, unadulterated class.

It was a nice little scare we had in the end. I'm glad it happened in retrospect. It confirmed what Brendan Rodgers has been saying about 'no easy games'. It won't happen again. We'll win the next 3 and we'll win them handsomely. This team is too good for its opponents.
"If you want the world to love you don't discuss Middle Eastern politics" Saul Bellow.

Online Crosby Nick

  • He was super funny. Used to do these super hilarious puns
  • RAWK Scribe
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 111,921
  • Poultry in Motion
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2014, 03:00:29 pm »
Watching that second goal again last night I counted 18 passes from Gerrard intercepting a Norwich attack with his head to Suarez scoring. Yet we made it look effortless.

Another nervy finish but that can only help give us the confidence to see this through. It also provides encouragement that Norwich themselves,and the likes of West Brom and Cardiff are going to be awkward opponents at this time of year. We had enough to deal with it, will Chelsea and City?

Offline robgomm

  • He just can't get enough of Luis Suarez.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 10,087
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2014, 07:51:25 pm »
Second goal, we pass out of defence, we move it to the wing, we cross the ball and we score. Keep the ball. To read people fuming at "fannying around at the back" after yesterday was baffling. It's the basis for what we do.

I have a question for PoP and all you guys much smarter than me, how has our defensive shape and plan evolved over the season? It strikes me we defend deeper than we did, getting numbers behind the ball and closing out the space moreso than defending from the front. I am basing on this on my amateurish observations of course and I don't take notes so, worse, it's coming from a maelstrom of memories. But it strikes me that Skrtel is doing so well because the way we defend seems to suit him really well (not to say he hasn't improved anyway, certainly on the ball).

Offline Fitzy.

  • I before E, except in Dalglish. Thumbs down for thumbs up! Premature ejaculator in the post-match whopper circle jerk. Might be the Rupert Pupkin to Neil Atkinson's Jerry Langford. Wants to know who did this, but may never find out.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 22,088
  • Indefatigability
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2014, 08:06:31 pm »
Interesting analysis by Carragher and Neville regarding our positioning at the back as we defend leads. Showed us against City and Norwich how Skrtel and Sakho got closer to our goal as time went on, inviting pressure and failing to protect the 18 yard box sufficiently. Basically, we are not keeping the ball out of the dangerous areas as our back two - and the rest - appear craven and too ready to slip into a backs to the wall mentality which is far from helpful in being able to recover possession and control the game.

This may well have been pointed out elsewhere, but the prevailing concern from a select minority following the match was our propensity to pass it around at the back. This really isn't the problem. When we are in possession we are better than anyone. But when we are defending leads we are sometimes an accident waiting to happen. The shape has to change as we head towards nirvana.

Offline Lazy Gun

  • Anny Roader
  • ****
  • Posts: 403
  • My wife, Jurgena.
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2014, 08:18:41 pm »
First half we were wonderful with passing and movement at pace.  More than a match for any team.

Second half Norwich seemed to adjust and we didn't respond quickly enough. Strangely I was completely stressed out watching the second half, but never really believed they would score (till they did), or felt that we would lose.  Whether these conflicting emotions are borne of over-complacency or belief in the team I've no idea, but it's weird.

I am concerned that in due course teams will fathom how better to play us, but with the tactical flexibility we seem to possess, and new options we can bring in during the window hopefully we can stay ahead of the game.
Believer

Online Fruity

  • Batty. Box clever. Can weather all lifts. May in fact be Robbie Rotten.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 6,196
  • a fruit is not just for christmas...
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2014, 08:25:33 pm »
We go again.
Nerves? Perceived lack of outlet with no Daniel? Unusual line up? (I'm still not entirely sure how we did line up. 2-1-4-2? Wiser tacticians will enlighten us). Whatever way, that was the game we feared it might be. Once again we were one team in the first half and a very different one in the second. I thought the fact we hadn't won the league would actually lift the weight off us, no worry about how to play, just keep on heading that way to their goal and we'll be ok. But Norwich were fighting for their survival and we let them. We let them come onto us and we sat back and we didn't press as I've seen us press. Yet...
So without Henderson, Johnson wasn't sure where to pass instinctively and got us caught a few times. Without Sturridge, the opponents defence would concentrate on Suarez and let Sterling run from deeper without real initial concern. But it was that running that got us the goals...
How would you line us up now? For Chelsea? Meantime we won, not that you'd think it from a lot of people, and we took a massive 3 points from Norwich which means they'll have to try harder. Against Chelsea for example. Come on.

3 games left. The nerves are building. We go again.

This post pretty much sums up everything I saw. We did miss Sturridge as it isolated Suarez. We didn't press well as Norwich seemed to win every 2nd ball after the first 15 minutes. And we sat back which lead to us becoming more pedestrian. Two nil up after 10 minutes should have killed Norwich who looked absolutely shell shocked. The only fans you could hear was ours, but we allowed them back into the game. Its almost like at 2-0 do we stick or twist and we are a much better team when we twist. Its our attacking play that makes us an all round great team not our sitting back and trying to soak up pressure.

I think we looked the more tired of the two sides at the end of the match. Whether that was nervous energy having an impact I don't know. Also Suarez was well shepherded and at times I thought he looked like he was carrying an injury. He struggled through that 2nd half.

Nerves do seem to be playing a big part now.
alf a pound of braeburns!

Offline MobileBayRed

  • Kopite
  • *****
  • Posts: 818
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2014, 08:45:25 pm »
We go again.
Nerves? Perceived lack of outlet with no Daniel? Unusual line up? (I'm still not entirely sure how we did line up. 2-1-4-2? Wiser tacticians will enlighten us). Whatever way, that was the game we feared it might be. Once again we were one team in the first half and a very different one in the second. I thought the fact we hadn't won the league would actually lift the weight off us, no worry about how to play, just keep on heading that way to their goal and we'll be ok. But Norwich were fighting for their survival and we let them. We let them come onto us and we sat back and we didn't press as I've seen us press. Yet...
So without Henderson, Johnson wasn't sure where to pass instinctively and got us caught a few times. Without Sturridge, the opponents defence would concentrate on Suarez and let Sterling run from deeper without real initial concern. But it was that running that got us the goals...
How would you line us up now? For Chelsea? Meantime we won, not that you'd think it from a lot of people, and we took a massive 3 points from Norwich which means they'll have to try harder. Against Chelsea for example. Come on.

3 games left. The nerves are building. We go again.

Great OP.  Job done, but it looked a little different than the last few months.  Norwich should be applauded for their fight, they could have packed it in after 2-0 and again at 3-1, but didn't.

Not sure what the formation/shape was.  1st half it looked like Sterling was up top with Suarez, second half it looked like Suarez up by himself.  Change in personnel and change in formation certainly made us look disjointed.  As you say, the usual outlets were not always there.  Lucas, Allen and Gerrard all in the lineup.  Have we played with all three in those positions before?  People in other threads saying Lucas had a poor game.  It wasn't his prettiest game (ugly last 10 minutes) but I just think he was having to fight his positional instincts.  Not sure whether he or Sterling was supposed to give Johnson cover on the right side but it seemed like we were a little open on that side.  That said he was still Lucas; challenging every possession.  Thought we was one of the few Reds up for the physical fight that Norwich brought. 

There were times that we just struggled to get the ball out of our own half.  Were we resting on the ball?  Were we bothered by their pressing?  Were we keeping our shape properly?

Im not really bothered by the Mignolet error.  He's a young keeper adjusting to our style of play.  Early on in the season he was too glued to his line.  I like a more aggressive Mignolet, even if it means an occasional mistake.  This was a mistake of aggression, not passivity.  I think he will learn from this.

Sterling. . .just beautiful.  Brought art to a game that was otherwise a sloppy affair.  Was a step above everyone else, including Suarez.  His pass to Suarez was laser perfect.  Reminded me of the ball to Sturridge last week, except for Suarez knew how to finish it.  A pure joy to watch.

All in all, a good road win against a team fighting relegation after an emotional win against City.  Job done.  3 points.  Corrections for Brendan to make during the week.  No injuries, no sendings off.

We go again Sunday.
just can't confirm that delivery address and consequently gets non stop pelters off PayPal.

Offline redbyrdz

  • No to sub-optimal passing! Not content with one century, this girl does two together. Oh, and FUCK THE TORIES deh-deh-deh-deh!
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 24,265
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2014, 09:03:54 pm »
Rodgers said we played with a diamond first (Sterling at the top) and then changed to 4-3-3 with Sterling one of the wide players.

We are breathtakingly good when attacking. True poetry in motion. But we're not so hot at this defending a lead business. We sit back too much and relax too much, and are then prone to individual mistakes or we let someone run through our midfield and have a free go at goal. Maybe that's the same thing as what Fitzy reports above, that our CBs creep closer to our goal and we sit to deep. But to me its more the lack of attacking and urgency. Once we learn to defend with the same sort of calmness and confidence as we attack, we'll be a lot more solid.



Anyway. Three more points, one win closer to the title. Three more to go, next up: Chelsea.

This is not fucking slipping now.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 09:05:26 pm by redbyrdz »
"I want to build a team that's invincible, so that they have to send a team from bloody Mars to beat us." - Bill Shankly

Offline robgomm

  • He just can't get enough of Luis Suarez.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 10,087
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2014, 09:06:56 pm »
I heard him say we played an extra man in midfield:

Gerrard

Lucas - Allen

Sterling - Coutinho

and Suarez ahead of that. 4-3-2-1, like that quiz show.

Online Mighty_Red

  • Rojo Poderoso!
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 13,920
  • All hail the King...
    • Join the fight - SOS
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2014, 09:50:39 pm »
Bump

Can we just take E2Ks post and send it to the message inbox of every poster who posted all that negative bullshit in the after match thread? Yet again post right on the money E2K

Nobody denies that there were lots of mistakes in our play, there were and the game should've been put to bed before they came back.All I can ask of the team is to look at their mistakes yesterday and try and avoid them this Sunday. They know what they did wrong, and most of it wasn't strategic, just a lot of basic errors at the back. They also need to improve their focus in the first 15mins of the 2nd half when teams will come at them hard, they should expect it and deal with it a bit better.

Otherwise, this is gone, mission accomplished and onto the next mission on Sunday
Some clubs were always destined for greatness...

Offline houkura

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,058
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2014, 10:03:22 pm »
Rodgers said we played with a diamond first (Sterling at the top) and then changed to 4-3-3 with Sterling one of the wide players.

We are breathtakingly good when attacking. True poetry in motion. But we're not so hot at this defending a lead business. We sit back too much and relax too much, and are then prone to individual mistakes or we let someone run through our midfield and have a free go at goal. Maybe that's the same thing as what Fitzy reports above, that our CBs creep closer to our goal and we sit to deep. But to me its more the lack of attacking and urgency. Once we learn to defend with the same sort of calmness and confidence as we attack, we'll be a lot more solid.



Anyway. Three more points, one win closer to the title. Three more to go, next up: Chelsea.

This is not fucking slipping now.

I'm not sure we're actually not bad at defending a lead. We've done it very well all season. It's just that now we're playing teams fighting for their lives and our players themselves are on the brink of making history. A wee bit of nerves is to be expected. I think Rodgers doesn't want them to defend so deep but he can't play the game for them-he can only give instructions. It looks to me they are scared to concede late (and for good reason) and feel the best way to avoid that is to bunker in and defend.
"Good to be here, good to be anywhere."  --Keith Richards

Online robertobaggio37

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,252
  • But we will conquer the ball, each fucking time.
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2014, 10:18:08 pm »
I understand that people click into the ‘Round Table’ thread for posts which take a more measured, analytical approach to the game that’s just gone but, if I’m being honest, that’s not me tonight ladies and gents (maybe it never is, to be fair). So scroll down if you want any of that. Let’s face it, the performance today could have been better both individually and as a team, and anyone who says as much is entitled to do so. Me, I’ve got no interest in it. I don’t have the stomach for any of that right now, picking over the bones of a victory that brings us three games away from something I still can’t even imagine like we’re at a fucking funeral or something. All the best to anyone who wants to do that, like, but no, not me. Not tonight. No, tonight I just feel like being belligerent in my love, respect and admiration for this team because they deserve it, and I simply can’t be arsed with anything other than singing its praises as loudly as I can.

All I really cared about at roughly 1.50 p.m. today was that Liverpool Football Club had picked up another three points in this relentless march towards history, that’s it. Today’s game didn’t mean anything to me beyond that, beyond another ‘W’ to add to this jaw-dropping, perhaps era-defining collection, its significance nothing more than a snapshot in time, one piece of something far greater in magnitude than a 3-2 win at Norwich City could ever be in and of itself. In the moment, of course, it meant everything. The last 15/20 today were pure, malevolent torture and as the minutes ticked slowly by, second by excruciating second, it felt like time was going backwards. This was as important as any other game on this beautiful ride and then some, be it Arsenal, Fulham, Swansea, Southampton, Manchester United, Cardiff, Sunderland, Tottenham, West Ham or Manchester City, some of which saw much better football played and far more impressive scorelines amassed. But then the moment passed and the result was absorbed once again, beamed up into the mothership just like the other 10 or 34, a part of something infinitely more important than fleeting issues surrounding the performances of Lucas, Johnson or Mignolet, the shape of the team or how much we missed Henderson. All footnotes, friends, footnotes to history.

One team faced another today, with different prizes at stake of monumental importance, and they crashed into one other at full pelt. Liverpool shipped a few blows, no doubt about it. Norwich drew blood, then they drew it again. Were any of us expecting an easy day at the office? Truly? Were any of us expecting a stroll, maybe another 5-0 to match the Spurs game back in December in which 10 of that starting 11 took the field? Well we shouldn’t have, especially after what Sunderland (statistically still the division’s worst team) have done to ourselves and our title rivals in recent weeks. This was a battle. I said it before the game and I’ll say it again, pure desire straight from the gut, straight from the soul, straight from somewhere they don’t tell you about on Sky Super Sunday or on Match of the Day is what teams like Norwich City used to wield over Liverpool for so long, for virtually my entire lifetime supporting this wonderful club. It was the only weapon they had to level the playing field against the Fowlers and Owens, the Gerrards and Torres’, the Bergers and McManamans. We had the ability, they had the balls. Too often games were played out like nothing more than fistfights for survival in the dirt and Liverpool fucking hated that, always, for as long as I’ve known Liverpool teams, they hated it, couldn’t respond. And let’s not be arrogant here, the process of scraping out results in games like that is not beneath champions, it's the mark of champions. How many times did Liverpool teams of yesteryear win games like that? How often did Ferguson’s Manchester United? How many times was the mantra proven by championship-winning teams that if you want to play football we’ll play football, and if you want to scrap we’ll knock you out?

That’s the most important thing to take away from today. Norwich wanted to fight, not in the literal sense obviously but in the metaphorical one. Their approach was to run and tackle and hit us with every last ounce of physical effort they had in their bodies and make it so that if they lost, it wouldn’t have been for want of desire. They did that, and they did it superbly. They went down swinging with everything they had, but they went down all the same. Norwich don’t have the ability but they’ve got the fight and it would have been enough against plenty of Liverpool teams over the past 24 years. Not today. Pure ability gave Liverpool three goals via the burgeoning, potentially world-class talent that is Raheem Sterling (his shot for the first, his cross for the second, his run for the third), but it was pure effort and animal hunger on our part which saw us over the line. Don’t underestimate it, don’t undervalue it, cherish it. It means everything because this game, at its core, is still about the human confrontation, 11 vs. 11. Liverpool earned that result today, and now it’s done, in the history books, part of something greater.

Those worried that a similar performance will spell doom next week or against the suddenly (supposedly) titanic Crystal Palace the week after are underestimating the sheer will-to-win of this team and the effect that has on opponents. They're also forgetting that the Rodgers era has been defined thus far by the minor detail, the adjustment, the fine margin, the manager able to squeeze every last iota of effort, ability, performance and, ultimately, end result out of what he’s got at his disposal. A performance like we saw today, where Norwich were able to exert a degree of control over key areas of the game, may happen again and it may not. Maybe Chelsea next week will be completely different, maybe it won’t, but honestly, has Brendan Rodgers given any of us reason to doubt him yet? Has he given us any indication that he won’t know how to approach these last three games, that he won’t know how to mitigate the loss of Henderson to a sufficient extent, that he won’t have his team ready? Has he fuck. WWWWWWWWWWW…

Here we are, a team in its infancy which has moved through its evolution at the speed of light and, sometimes, isn’t fully comfortable in its own skin. Some of these players will move on, others will come in and the evolution will continue. But that’s for next year and beyond, and I genuinely have no idea why anyone would want to think about that now. Three games to history, to something we’ve awaited for so long, just three. Why look too far into the future when the present is so fucking beautiful?

This is brilliant. Best post I've read here in a long time. Well fucking said.
The biggest problem anywhere in the world is that people's perceptions of reality are filtered through the screening mesh of what they want, and do not want, to be true.

Offline Asam

  • has a mankini
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 6,970
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2014, 10:22:07 pm »

re the defense

Yes Skrtel and Sakho may possibly be retreating too far back when we are under pressure, however we seem to give the ball away constantly as we are clearing the lines with poor percentage passes (for a passing side) .

We don't smother teams and extinguish the threat before it gets to our final third


Offline Notorious IT

  • Gilt complex.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,031
  • Alcoholic
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2014, 10:33:00 pm »
Anyone that didn't punch the air when the final whistle went yesterday, simply wasn't doing it right.

Scary, and yet delightful, that my initial thought on Van Wolfswinkle's miss was we would have scored another, rather than berate the defence.

Offline robgomm

  • He just can't get enough of Luis Suarez.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 10,087
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #19 on: April 21, 2014, 10:36:12 pm »
Anyone that didn't punch the air when the final whistle went yesterday, simply wasn't doing it right.

I realised how low the ceiling is in my room while punching the air.

Offline GrkStav

  • Has a statuette of Lucas on the bonnet of his car which he polishes lovingly with Lucas Brasso. Glen Johnson's biggest fan. Doesn't have a "fucken clue" where L4 is
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,981
  • Not very good at 'banter'.
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #20 on: April 21, 2014, 11:48:47 pm »
re the defense

Yes Skrtel and Sakho may possibly be retreating too far back when we are under pressure, however we seem to give the ball away constantly as we are clearing the lines with poor percentage passes (for a passing side) .

We don't smother teams and extinguish the threat before it gets to our final third

Well, the two lines in bold kinda go together, right? If, after having for whatever reason surrendered possession and not recovered it relatively early we end up being subjected to intense assault, usually from the flanks and, when we do get the chance to recover possession or release a counter-attack we fail, we're likely not to have a chance to "smother teams and extinguish the threat before it gets to our final third".

Not just for a 'passing' team, but for a team that actually does that to the opposition (hunt in packs to recover possession high up the pitch), you'd think we'd be better at (or have better automatisms drilled in) releasing or relieving pressure. We missed Sturridge as an outlet. He's not the most prolific in terms of winning headers, but he's a great outlet pass target. The drawback to switching to a 4-5-1 (4-1-2-2-1)(effectively), i.e. not replacing Sturridge with e.g Aspas was sacrificing the 'outlet'. Sterling and Coutinho could have been our outlets, but I'm afraid they were not (in part due to them, in part due to the iffy passes to them).
Ludi Circenses!

Offline Bobinhood

  • RAWK's Pam Ayres. Man without a hat.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 9,927
  • Hand over the Trophy
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #21 on: April 22, 2014, 12:05:16 am »
Good OP.

Right now games are becoming street brawls. Most people are playing for either historical glory or big money, one or the other. I think Suarez took a big knock Sterling took one Gerrard was limping after half an hour, Skrtl got kicked hard, we gave as good as we got right back....here until the verdicts are in at either end of the table, forms out as anything more than a rough guide. Its really down to the brave and the lucky because if the difference to you was 20k a week which league you played in you'd lace em up pretty tight as well.

We prevailed, under those circumstances. Our bravery and luck at least equaled their bravery and luck, and so we were more skilled going forward and won. That's a freaking great 3 points and I don't care if we were pinned back at times. Its to be expected. The last 4 games are a new season in themselves.

BUT:

There will be no slippage.  ;D
Amplification does not equal truth. 

"Put these seeds in your pocket. At least sunflowers will grow where you lie!"
A Ukrainian housewife to a young Russian soldier, Feb 24,2022.

Offline Robinred

  • Wanted for burglary.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 13,751
  • Red since '64
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #22 on: April 22, 2014, 12:07:29 am »
[snip]
It won't happen again.

By God I wish I had your faith Yorky.

Because if ever a football team had Jekyll and Hyde tendencies, it's this one. I just love the way we go through the gears in those early stages. The football is breathtaking and worthy of every plaudit we receive.

But the pattern of allowing inferior teams back into games is now so regular, so, dare I say, inevitable, as to be beyond coincidence, beyond mere "well, they were bound to have their bit of pressure, just see out the storm". And that, to this observer is worrying.

In part this is because I'm old, and a natural worrier. But I'm also a realist, a realist who has spent a lifetime watching and playing sport. Sport, where anything is possible.

Not that I lack faith in Brendan and the players, far from it. I have a betting slip from last July. I backed Liverpool at 36 on Betfair (35/1 in old money) to win the premiership. I'm a pensioner, so my modest stake was only 4 quid.

And those betting sites now have us at 1/4.

So when I read all the "call to arms" posts, all those fist-pumping, emotion-fuelled male bonding clarion calls, the purpose of which is to mask the (very real) possibility of fucking up when so close to glory, I know what's going on; it's a strange mixture of incredulous elation and horrible fatalism.

I know, from a long lifetime of experience of life's vagaries, of sport-as-a-reflection-of-life's peculiar tendency to evoke old Sod's immutable law, that it's not over until it's over.

I'll be much happier when it is.


« Last Edit: April 22, 2014, 12:09:32 am by Robinred »
"The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology...as long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth." Mikhail Bakunin

Offline sms1986

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 24,644
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #23 on: April 22, 2014, 12:35:57 am »
I correctly predicted that the other Sunday games would end up being a 3-0 win for Arsenal and a 2-0 win for Everton. For our game, I guess I was too strongly influenced by previous encounters where we thrashed Norwich, as I predicted a 7-1 victory for us at Carrow Road. It wasn't that easy for us this time, almost as if Norwich know deep down that they won't survive this time around so decided not to let Suarez and company have one last rout.

The most important thing is that we went again, we got the three points, and now we need to go again at home next Sunday, against Chelsea.

Offline slimbo

  • Kopite
  • *****
  • Posts: 777
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #24 on: April 22, 2014, 12:57:40 am »
Very excited after going 2-0 up so early. I thought maybe this was going to be another day where we put seven or eight past them. But to Norwich credit, they kept with their game plan of pressing heavily and it started to pay off.

I could be wrong and happy to be corrected but I think we missed Hendo and Sturridge today for a couple of reasons. I think one of Hendo's key attributes to this team is not just his defensive work but the fact his engine gets him back into position to be an outlet for Johnson and Flanagan. I know Flano is a big favourite but both he and Johnson are limited in possession and if the outlet isn't there we struggle when they have the ball under pressure. Stevie didn't have the legs or support to cover the ground he needed to and in fairness one wasn't enough with the pressing Norwich were doing. He needed another one doing the work. It became more and more evident as we continually turned the ball over passing it around the back and failing to bypass their midfield to a player sitting in the pocket or a bit deeper from the front. Something Sturridge does very well, and keeps the ball well when he does get it in those positions and I think we sorely missed what he offers here.

The other thing which has been curious in the past two games is how deep we have been prepared to sit. It makes for uncomfortable viewing as we invite teams to whip in crosses, or in City's case play one, two's inside our penalty area. At one point we turned the ball over in Norwich half and as they came forward you could see our players retreating to our own defensive third almost immediately, leaving huge chasms of space for Norwich players to run into. I'm not sure we can do that against Chelsea this week.

There's still plenty of season to go. One loss gives City the upper hand but they have their challenges ahead too. In the end it was a gutsy win marked by the brilliant Sterling once again. I'm sure the performance will keep us grounded. Nearly there.

Offline kaz1983

  • "Bloody Memory Wavers" Currently in debt with RAWK.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 9,505
  • Well dunno what to say, honest
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #25 on: April 22, 2014, 12:59:40 am »
Sterling really is starting to look like the player he was in the reserves, only he's doing it to senior pros now. Balance, poise, power, and now the end product.

Was thinking just that.

That second goal wow. The mazy run and the cut in from the right - reminded me for of the way he'd cut open defenses in the under 21's

Offline Aristotle

  • is a bugger for the bottle. Apache tool wielder extraordinaire - especially in wardrobes. The 'Oral B' Specialist.....brushes his cavities vigorously outdoors.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 14,438
  • Happiness depends upon ourselves
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #26 on: April 22, 2014, 01:31:56 am »
Football is a strange game and the small margins make all the difference, all the time. I finally got up the courage to watch it again because in the moment you could've had a stampede of pink elephants trying to fly and I wouldn't have noticed.

I'm with E2K on that any analysis is beyond the game. If this is game 3 or 4 and not 34 there are warning signs. Johnson looked like there was an actual canary flying around in his head during the game. Mignolet's decision to come for the cross when Skrtel had the better position is inexplicable. Coutinho and Allen off instead of Lucas was another strange one. But this was a testement to our strength of will. This time last season we'd have buckled under those kind of things. Today though, we just see it through. We might have lost a few kilos in sweat, paced around in a pattern that leaves a dent in the floor and the sustained pulse beats any workout you've ever done. But we get there and that's all that matters.

There's one thing I'll say that I took away from this match. I think people are being extremely harsh on Lucas. He's playing out of position in his first start in more than 3 months. He played well enough and as well as you'd expect from a guy in his shoes, not fully match fit, playing 90 minutes after the injuries he's suffered. He might've had a bad day at the office overall, but he can't be faulted for effort and he had a very bright start and was more done for by our own wastefulness and dropping too deep when his natural instincts (over the past few years) have been to drop between the center backs instead of pushing forward. I'm not saying he was brilliant but he just played the cards he was dealt and has been subject to very harsh criticism.

Actually make that two things I took from that match. Their coach (Adams?) ended their chances when he took off Leroy Fer after their 2nd goal. It was an incredibly stupid thing to do by a man inspired to be pictured going down swinging rather than one who wanted to secure a point. Fer was their most calm passer and he found space in Coutinho's absence. Moses wanted to score a goal to show the world what he could do and had neither the positional awareness nor the mentality of young Pip to hang on to his marker. Allen was also covering more and more for Lucas as the game went on and the Brazilian tired. Fer's replacement, Murphy, got dispossed, passed out for a throw in and made a total of 4 passes. I'm convinced that his introduction was what inspired Rodgers to take Allen instead of Sterling off in Agger's place as he didn't need to match the energetic Dutchman in midfield and could rely on Sterling's pace to make up for the lost ground Allen conceded.

Which brings me back to my original point of small margins. Lucas wins a fairly basic tackle on 9th minute. Instead of putting out for a throw in, he keeps it in and shuffles it to Coutinho. Allen loses Fer, Coutinho finds him. Allen shoots and Ruddy makes a great save. Twist one variable and it becomes "great to have Lucas back", 1-0 becomes 2-0 and the Norwich back 4 start thinking "fookin' hell, lads, Suarez hasn't even started yet". But 1-0 did become 2-0 and what a goal it was too. But there were more. The amazing pass from Suarez to Coutinho that sent a chill down the back of Xabi Alonso and his passing legacy. Sterling takes one more touch and it's game over. Coutinho's wide shot just before the half instead of finding Suarez to twist the dagger just before half-time.

But even with all of those the defining moment in the game was van Wolfwinkel's header on the 82nd minute. That was the moment of the game. Mignolet's missed cross was dumb, but who cares, really? Law of averages means that goalkeepers make them, especially ones that have been out of the game for long. Buffon makes them to this day and he knows a thing or two about goalkeeping and keeping his focus. Anyone who brings Reina into it needs to take a look at themselves in the mirror and take up sex with trees or something. It's not about one or the other. Even if we wanted to it's against the laws of the game so fucking shut up about it. Sterling cancelled it out anyway. Much like Jesus he was shit at dealing with crosses around Easter time [as those of you smart enough to follow me on twitter will have hilariously noted]. But the biggest margin of that game was his saved header. It was a defining moment of the game and may well have changed our's and Norwich's season. It was the mirror-opposite of the Macheda moment. I swear it happened in slow-motion. I saw who the header was for and I saw everything turn black - the newspaper headlines popped into my head. Like Connor Wickham finding his shooting boots, this was the quentessential football moment I thought. Player who hadn't scored since his debut comes on and with his first attempt on goal breaks Liverpool's hearts. Mignolet had been beaten by two crosses already, the young Dutchman leaping above the rest. Down the header went, under Mignolet and then [even as I write this I can feel myself grasping for air!] it was saved. The moment that inspires Norwich that anything is possible undone. The moment where we are pushed to the brink and salvaged. Anyone who wants to take anything from this game defensively and in regards to Mignolet and his place in the team just look at that (and just to reiterate if you use Reina to argue with or against Mignolet - go have sex with a tree).

That is mental fortitude. That is concentration and ability. That is coming up big when push comes to shove. That is the type of save that wins championships.
My twitter
If Harry can get Spurs to the CL 1/4 final then he could get England to the World Cup final.

Offline B0151?

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 19,141
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #27 on: April 22, 2014, 02:19:46 am »
Thought Neville and Carra's analysis (it's in the video thread) seemed accurate. Skrtel and Sakho both dropping far too deep and not pushing up really invites pressure onto us. I think that's more out of nerves than anything. Skrtel obviously feels a lot more comfortable defending his box (indeed, that's his greatest strength), but it really does us no favours.

We're probably going to be sitting a little deeper regardless of our intentions once we have the lead against a good side, but we really need to consciously make the effort to push up a bit. Otherwise the comeback always seems inevitable.

It's easy to say we're bailed out by our attacking talent but I think some of the deep defending is born out of the fact that the team know how dangerous we are on the counter so want to just concentrate on defending. It's a really risky game to play though.

Online wemmick

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,916
  • "Do it half-assed. That's the American Way!"
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #28 on: April 22, 2014, 02:26:25 am »
Agreed about this game and those up coming are beyond analysis. They are too much like cup finals now. One thing I do think will come out of them is what qualities we need to strengthen in the squad this off season or, alternatively, develop players for certain roles. For example, I'm not sure Gerrard, Allen and Lucas compliment each other in midfield. Perhaps that is because Coutinho  and Sterling played in sort-of free roles? I don't know, to be honest, but the midfield lacked some dynamism and cohesion, and has for parts of the season. I wondered during the game whether or not Suso would have been a better fit than Lucas with Gerrard and Allen but Henderson out. Not a dig at Lucas mind. I thought he did okay, and probably would have been better with more match fitness, but I was just thinking forward in terms of complimentary combinations. Any thoughts on this? We only seemed to really gel early on, and I'm not sure if that was down to personnel or that we just got a bit panicky after they scored their first.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2014, 02:28:43 am by wemmick »

Offline Canuck33

  • Anny Roader
  • ****
  • Posts: 431
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #29 on: April 22, 2014, 02:44:18 am »
I know we are top of the league with 3 games to go. We have it within our hands to win this thing and end the 24 year draught. Yes, we won again on the weekend. And don't anyone get me wrong, but it was by the skin of our teeth, again. Because by the time the smoke clears, if we really do win it this time around, and I pray for that, it'll come down to being carried by 4 or 5 people, not counting the manager.

The first and most influential of them is the skip. Steven Gerrard has been the heart, soul and engine of this team. A true warrior going about his business on a regular basis. And that at an age most would consider the waning end at that level, topped by the reality of having to adapt to a new position.

The second one is Luis Suarez. A loose cannon turned into a team player. His energy, as evident as it always was, funnelled into contribution rather than controversy. Is he gonna be someone young people will look up to some day? I believe so, but the jury is still out.

The third one is Martin Skrtel. A tower of strength at the back. Losing his position to an aging Carragher last season must have been devastating. But the recovery of that humiliation is nothing short of a miracle.

The forth one is Raheem Sterling. A great talent given a real chance last year by the boss to show his stuff. Performed well for a while and then fell off the radar due to personal problems, but most importantly, due to immaturity. Well, what a comeback! It's the kind of stuff tales are made from.

I know there should be some other mentions, but I'll refrain from that. I also know that there'll be comments of "team effort" and such coming, but I don't care. I believe that the individual efforts of these four lads have put us where we are. And if not single, or quadruple, handedly so, then by their inspiration and outstanding work.

Offline deFacto please, you bastards

  • Apologies if I haven't responded to every post in every thread yet, I'm trying hard. farKnow.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 35,685
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #30 on: April 22, 2014, 02:52:29 am »
I know we are top of the league with 3 games to go. We have it within our hands to win this thing and end the 24 year draught. Yes, we won again on the weekend. And don't anyone get me wrong, but it was by the skin of our teeth, again. Because by the time the smoke clears, if we really do win it this time around, and I pray for that, it'll come down to being carried by 4 or 5 people, not counting the manager.

The first and most influential of them is the skip. Steven Gerrard has been the heart, soul and engine of this team. A true warrior going about his business on a regular basis. And that at an age most would consider the waning end at that level, topped by the reality of having to adapt to a new position.

The second one is Luis Suarez. A loose cannon turned into a team player. His energy, as evident as it always was, funnelled into contribution rather than controversy. Is he gonna be someone young people will look up to some day? I believe so, but the jury is still out.

The third one is Martin Skrtel. A tower of strength at the back. Losing his position to an aging Carragher last season must have been devastating. But the recovery of that humiliation is nothing short of a miracle.

The forth one is Raheem Sterling. A great talent given a real chance last year by the boss to show his stuff. Performed well for a while and then fell off the radar due to personal problems, but most importantly, due to immaturity. Well, what a comeback! It's the kind of stuff tales are made from.

I know there should be some other mentions, but I'll refrain from that. I also know that there'll be comments of "team effort" and such coming, but I don't care. I believe that the individual efforts of these four lads have put us where we are. And if not single, or quadruple, handedly so, then by their inspiration and outstanding work.

No it's a team effort because when the likes of Suarez weren't available, Sturridge stepped up and carried the burden up front. Score dgoals and help us win matches. He's been brilliant since returning from his injury in the new year. So did Mignolet with some of his saves, he's done more positive things for the outcome of our matches than negative.

When Gerrard was injured, the likes of Henderson stepped up and now has tons of people moaning about his absence and how it affects us. He's improved massively and has contributed with his work and effort to the progress we've made collectively. Then there's Flannagan who was never really supposed to play as much as he has, but he took the opportunity once it arrived.

So no, you couldn't be more wrong. This is a collective effort. It's not just four players, the evidence is there,blatant and it proves you're wrong.

P.S. You can't win every match comfortably, it doesn't happen.

Offline GrkStav

  • Has a statuette of Lucas on the bonnet of his car which he polishes lovingly with Lucas Brasso. Glen Johnson's biggest fan. Doesn't have a "fucken clue" where L4 is
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,981
  • Not very good at 'banter'.
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #31 on: April 22, 2014, 06:30:57 am »
I am sorry to have to ask this, but are we back to the malarkey about our midfield's "lack of dynamism", "lack of mobility" and the rest of it, in the mere absence of Henderson?
Ludi Circenses!

Offline Wernerred

  • Anny Roader
  • ****
  • Posts: 352
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #32 on: April 22, 2014, 09:56:59 am »
Great OP.  Job done, but it looked a little different than the last few months.  Norwich should be applauded for their fight, they could have packed it in after 2-0 and again at 3-1, but didn't.

Spot on post mate, and great OP indeed. I was hoping for a little longer comment from Yorkykopite as he's a joy to read. Less is more sometimes I guess. Enjoy the ride.

Offline Gerrard[LFC]

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,258
  • We are all part of Liverpool-FC
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #33 on: April 22, 2014, 10:24:53 am »
I think Rodgers doesn't want them to defend so deep but he can't play the game for them-he can only give instructions. It looks to me they are scared to concede late (and for good reason) and feel the best way to avoid that is to bunker in and defend.
Don't want to sound too negative but on this point, everyone can see we conceded more goals when
we defend so deep, invite unnecessary pressure, so Rodgers job is to tell them that, that bunkering in isn't the way to go. Make them realise that and try not to do it.
Maybe this is where we missed bit of Carraghers shouting ( not sure if that helped much in honesty :D)
want them to push out quicker and avoid pressure like in the analysis by Carra and Neville,
realise its not the best way.
I dread we will/could do same against Chelsea and like man city we could invite pressure and this time
could have different result, and only ourselves to blame.
The greater danger for most of us lies not in setting our aim too high and falling short; but in setting our aim too low, and achieving our mark.
MICHELANGELO

Offline Greebo62

  • Matchday Project Manager. Amazingly Available! Apply within, ladies.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,322
  • Justice for the 96
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #34 on: April 22, 2014, 10:56:50 am »
Aye, here we are with problems at the top of the league.

 Seriously some people need to get a grip and re read E2K's post. This is the round table thread. We are three games from the end of a season in which we passed all expectations already, and we're seven points from the our first ever premier league title. Players have come in and stepped up, the team ethic is there, yet people still want to moan.

Its late April, we're playing teams with a lot to fight for and still winning. End of.

« Last Edit: April 22, 2014, 10:58:30 am by Greebo62 »
Believe...

Offline 007.lankyguy

  • Subject of a restraining order by a regular member of the HIGNFY crew. Hasn't got a clue when Liverpool play next. Fully stopped.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 7,655
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #35 on: April 22, 2014, 11:02:15 am »
Don't want to sound too negative but on this point, everyone can see we conceded more goals when
we defend so deep, invite unnecessary pressure, so Rodgers job is to tell them that, that bunkering in isn't the way to go. Make them realise that and try not to do it.
Maybe this is where we missed bit of Carraghers shouting ( not sure if that helped much in honesty :D)
want them to push out quicker and avoid pressure like in the analysis by Carra and Neville,
realise its not the best way.
I dread we will/could do same against Chelsea and like man city we could invite pressure and this time
could have different result, and only ourselves to blame.
It will be less of an issue against Chelsea than it was against Man City - Chelsea tend to struggle against low blocks and they have a pretty restrictive template in midfield, unlike City. It's still something an area we need to be more aggressive in - Norwich kept having players move into the channels completely unmarked on Sunday and we generally struggle to deal with players getting in the half spaces, between the centre and the flanks. Against Chelsea it may be less of a problem and the transition is the main area I'm worried about with them but it could still be an issue. At Stamford Bridge we were overloaded between the lines and if Mourinho goes the same way (which he should) then we might have problems. I think we'll play a diamond again because Chelsea do play pretty narrow but should Mourinho open them up and play down the flanks more to cause us to lose shape in midfield, thereby creating more space between the lines, it might be better changing back to 4-3-3.
"Mind you, I've been here during the bad times too - one year we came second." Sir Bob

Offline Yorkykopite

  • Misses Danny Boy with a passion. Phil's Official Biographer, dontcherknow...it's all true. Honestly.
  • RAWK Writer
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 34,484
  • The first five yards........
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #36 on: April 22, 2014, 11:06:45 am »
Seriously some people need to get a grip and re read E2K's post. This is the round table thread. We are three games from the end of a season in which we passed all expectations already, and we're seven points from the our first ever premier league title. Players have come in and stepped up, the team ethic is there, yet people still want to moan.

Odd definition of what the round table thread "is" plus an odd interpretation of what posters in it are doing.

I don't think anyone's moaning. Just asking legitimate questions about what the defence was doing wrong on Sunday. I'd have thought this is exactly the thread to be asking those questions.

"If you want the world to love you don't discuss Middle Eastern politics" Saul Bellow.

Offline nightporter

  • Nothing personal, but good riddance.
  • Main Stander
  • ***
  • Posts: 157
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #37 on: April 22, 2014, 11:08:29 am »
The lads did a great job against a good team that played their hearts out. (it does beg the question - Why don't these teams concentrate on playing like that every game, instead of just trying to spoil someone elses party?)

One other thing, no new contract for Johnson please Brendan.
'Vagiclean, huh? What's the matter, honey? Little extra cheese on the taco?'

'Price check on Vagiclean, aisle five. I repeat: price check on Vagiclean, aisle five. That's Vagiclean. We've got a customer down here with a full-on fallopian fungus. She's baking a loaf of bread and I think it's sourdough.'

Offline robgomm

  • He just can't get enough of Luis Suarez.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 10,087
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #38 on: April 22, 2014, 11:22:18 am »
I think we'll play a diamond again because Chelsea do play pretty narrow but should Mourinho open them up and play down the flanks more to cause us to lose shape in midfield, thereby creating more space between the lines, it might be better changing back to 4-3-3.

Insightful post as usual mate. I was thinking this morning just after I woke up about the diamond. Because that's what happens now, apparently, I think about football when I wake up. I guess you can see it two ways: 1) it will squeeze the middle and allow us to control possession early; 2) it'll leave us short on the flanks against dangerous wide men (especially Hazard, though he may not be fit).

Chelsea have the highest numbers of shots per game in the league and third highest shots on target per game. But they seem much less efficient in terms of actually scoring from them, partly through lack of strikers and partly because of the sort of opportunities they create. How many times have we seen them dominate games but be lacking ideas in front of a low block, shooting from range etc.. Set pieces and taking advantage of space left on transitions seems to be there way, so it wouldn't surprise me if we actually ceded possession (as against Arsenal, Everton) at least for a period to frustrate them.

I'm very torn on how I'd approach the game, which is good because I don't have to :D The great thing is that Mourinho, who clearly puts an awful lot of time into preparing for an opposition, will not be able to say for sure what formation we'll play as we've used so many.

Offline Yorkshire-Red

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,306
  • We all live in a Red and White Kop
Re: RAWK Round Table NCFC 2-3 LFC
« Reply #39 on: April 22, 2014, 11:34:57 am »
By the hour mark, and probably for some time before that, Lucas seemed to me to be totally used up. Barely able to run, I assumed his move to the point of the diamond was intended to give him a breather. It didn't make a difference because wherever he would have played from then on, he would have been too tired to press. The team had to fall back on marking space and with Johnson also off the pace they dropped deeper and deeper. When Moses stripped I thought it must be to replace Lucas, so was amazed to see Coutinho come off. I think my lad may have got it right when he said that Brendan might have been giving Lucas a chance to improve his match fitness before next weekend. If so it was a risk, but happily one that paid off.